Forehand Wrist Angle/Face Angle

[will2campb]

John: A number of the top pros (including Federer) have the face of their racquets closed at the bottom of the downswing on the forehand. What do you think the effect of the closed face is at this point in the swing? Also, have you determined the wrist angle relative to the forearm of the top players from the top of the forehand stroke to the bottom of the downswing. Some observers have said the angle is about 30-45 degrees and remains constant as the arm drops to the bottom of the downswing, while others have stated that the wrist remains in a "neutral" position.

Will Campbell

[johnyandell]

You make an incorrect assesment of the shape of the backswing for Federer.
First it isn't completely closed. Second this position disappears at the bottom of the backswing.


This observation falls into the category of confusing what is causal from what may be incidental or automatic. I'd suggest you read the Myth of the Backswing article and the Federer forehand articles. You might want to look at Fred Bye's forehand in Your Strokes as well to see the detrimental effect of stressing this closed face position. Yes it happens partially at some point in the backswing, but copying it intentionally is a bad idea in my view.

It's similar with the wrist angle. The exact angle of your wrist as you drop down is irrelevant and focusing on trying to match it to the exact degree is counterproductive. This falls into the "a little info is a dangerous thing" category.

What matters in the shape of the arm and the lay back in the wrist as the motion starts forward. The current fashionable argument about "relaxing" the wrist can be misleading because the movement that occurs from being nice and loose is something that just happens. I agree completely with Jeff Counts that the best way to set up the hitting arm shape is to create it as soon as possible as the racket falls in the backswing. If you have it and I mean really have it, yeah, then try softening everything up--but please don't start measuring the angle!


Some of the best players in the world may go in and out of this position a little faster than others, or the rest of us. But making that position at the right time is key to the forehand and I've filmed dozens and dozens of players who have problems achieving it and maintaining it. But they are convinced they are modeling the pros!

[will2campb]

Forehand: Closed face

John: You state that I incorrectly assessed the shape of Federer's backswing as "completely closed" and suggest that I read the Federer forehand articles. In your Federer forehand article, you stated:

"Most all of top players close the face of the racket at least somewhat as the racket starts down. Some players such as Roddick and Tommy Haas close the face until it is literally parallel with the surface of the court. Federer does this as well."

I stated that Federer's racquet face is "closed," but did not refer to it as "completely closed." My statement that his racquet face is closed does not appear to conflict with your statement that Federer "close[s] the face until it is literally parallel with the court." Also, when I stated that Federer's racquet face is closed at the bottom of the downswing, I did not state nor mean to suggest that the position does not change. I am aware that the closed or somewhat closed position is present and then disappears on the downswing. Many of the pros close their racquet faces on the downswing with apparently no detrimental effect. Fred Bye's closed face (and other mechanics) apparently had a detrimental effect on his stroke. In the end, I am simply curious whether the closed position on the downswing has some effect on the forehand stroke, particularly in a high level player with sound mechanics. I do not doubt that stressing the closed face position to many players could be detrimental.

With respect to the wrist angle, my question was prompted by analysts' apparently conflicting statements. I was simply trying to determine which statement is correct. I do not plan on measuring my wrist angle! Thanks.


Will Campbell

[johnyandell]

You wrote:
"A number of the top pros (including Federer) have the face of their racquets closed at the bottom of the downswing on the forehand."

To me closed means closed. But whatever the misunderstanding, I think the important point--my opinion and not that held by all--is not to worry about it and concentrate on the key positions.

As I explained in the backswing article, the angle of the racket face as it starts forward is mainly a function of the double bend and/or wrist back position at the start of the forward swing. If a player has a feel for that at the start of the foreswing that's is the most important aspect regarding this issue.