Upward Swing on the Serve: Most Complex Motion in Sports?

[stroke]

I have even practiced serving with a badminton shuttlecock. You have to really let go of tension to hit that thing and get it to spring off the strings.

[carollewise]

The thing that annoys me the most about the articles on the site is they are pre-cursor to sales, advertising based promoting a book/coach, anecdotal in nature and there are zero references, documentation and studies.

So Brian - clearly you are a high end coach - but, do you have published scientific papers?

Here is an example of the type of thing we are looking for here - Mark Kovacs - references are listed.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3445225/ ...

Is this site just not letting you post white papers with references and more in depth information just due to editorial reasons?

[don_budge]

Let's discuss Brian Gordon's latest article, "Upward Swing on the Serve: Most Complex Motion in Sports?"

Upward Swing on the Serve: Most Complex Motion in Sports? This is deep stuff Doc. I believe that it is one of the most complicated and this is why I believe so. For reasons unknown to everyone except myself...apparently...I have often compared the service motion to an upside down golf swing. Instead of teeing the ball on the ground we tee it up above us. Your question leads me to believe that I am closer to the truth of someone that anyone cares to suspect. It is the down swing in the golf swing that is one of the most mysterious and difficult manoeuvres to perform in the universe of sports. It is the transition from the backswing to the forwards swing...sort of like twilight. Where the night divides the day...or the other way around. It is certainly the moment of truth in both swings.

Excellent that you divide the entire entity into the four parts. Coincidentally the golf swing can also conveniently be divided similarly. This is where the real tempo of the swings is created and both are predicated on the patience for the thing to happen that allows the performer to perform a very complex motion with "frictionless motion". If performed correctly, the motion creates an "effortless power" that is one of the most beautiful physical sensations known to man. Almost on a par with you know what. Both the upward swing in the serve and the downward swing in golf culminate in a synergistic climactic ending. If performed correctly...I reiterate. Known as the happy ending in some circles.

Excellent video. Excellent explanation. Thank you!

[BrianGordon]

Hi don_budge - your explicit and implicit analogies continue to be second to none. Thanks for considering the presentation and the encouraging words. BG

[averymia]

Coincidentally the golf swing can also conveniently be divided similarly. This is where the real tempo of the swings is created and both are predicated on the patience for the thing to happen that allows the performer to perform a very complex motion with "frictionless motion". If performed correctly, the motion creates an "effortless power" that is one of the most beautiful physical sensations known to man.source: https://tennishunters.com/

[doctorhl]

Upward Swing on the Serve: Most Complex Motion in Sports? This is deep stuff Doc. I believe that it is one of the most complicated and this is why I believe so. For reasons unknown to everyone except myself...apparently...I have often compared the service motion to an upside down golf swing. Instead of teeing the ball on the ground we tee it up above us. Your question leads me to believe that I am closer to the truth of someone that anyone cares to suspect. It is the down swing in the golf swing that is one of the most mysterious and difficult manoeuvres to perform in the universe of sports. It is the transition from the backswing to the forwards swing...sort of like twilight. Where the night divides the day...or the other way around. It is certainly the moment of truth in both swings.

Excellent that you divide the entire entity into the four parts. Coincidentally the golf swing can also conveniently be divided similarly. This is where the real tempo of the swings is created and both are predicated on the patience for the thing to happen that allows the performer to perform a very complex motion with "frictionless motion". If performed correctly, the motion creates an "effortless power" that is one of the most beautiful physical sensations known to man. Almost on a par with you know what. Both the upward swing in the serve and the downward swing in golf culminate in a synergistic climactic ending. If performed correctly...I reiterate. Known as the happy ending in some circles.

Excellent video. Excellent explanation. Thank you!

Frictionless change of direction in a golf swing or tennis serve......an experience that kind of reminds me of the first time as a child when I was able to make a bullwhip "pop". I wonder if a piece of rope tied to a pros racket head or golf club head would pop at change of direction? (Ha!).

[don_budge]

Frictionless change of direction in a golf swing or tennis serve......an experience that kind of reminds me of the first time as a child when I was able to make a bullwhip "pop". I wonder if a piece of rope tied to a pros racket head or golf club head would pop at change of direction? (Ha!).

My dear old tennis coach spoke of the "Bullwhip Effect". That barely perceptible degree of separation that separates the backswing and the forwards swing. Truly...a moment of truth. The "Twilight Moment"...there exists a point between the night and day. In Hawaii when the sun dips into the ocean, there is once in a great while a very distinct flash of green when atmospheric conditions are perfect to that effect. I have seen that a couple of times. It is mostly local knowledge. Do we count to two when we reach that moment in the backswing and start towards the ball on two?

[stroke]

My dear old tennis coach spoke of the "Bullwhip Effect". That barely perceptible degree of separation that separates the backswing and the forwards swing. Truly...a moment of truth. The "Twilight Moment"...there exists a point between the night and day. In Hawaii when the sun dips into the ocean, there is once in a great while a very distinct flash of green when atmospheric conditions are perfect to that effect. I have seen that a couple of times. It is mostly local knowledge. Do we count to two when we reach that moment in the backswing and start towards the ball on two?

Good stuff. In order for the bullwhip to come into play, I think one needs to be able to feel the weight of the racquet head as one prepares for the start towards the ball on the 2 count. Certainly any kind of tension in the service motion is the enemy of feeling the weight of the racquet head as the racquet is held in hand.

[don_budge]

Truly...a moment of truth. The "Twilight Moment"...there exists a point between the night and day. In Hawaii when the sun dips into the ocean, there is once in a great while a very distinct flash of green when atmospheric conditions are perfect to that effect.

In order for the bullwhip to come into play, I think one needs to be able to feel the weight of the racquet head as one prepares for the start towards the ball on the 2 count. Certainly any kind of tension in the service motion is the enemy of feeling the weight of the racquet head as the racquet is held in hand.

Cue "green flash". Brilliant...which is not to say I agree with you. I don't have too. Perfectly said.

By the way...regarding that "green flash" moment. It occurs at precisely the point and moment where and when the sun disappears against the ocean horizon. Poof!

[doctorhl]

Good stuff. In order for the bullwhip to come into play, I think one needs to be able to feel the weight of the racquet head as one prepares for the start towards the ball on the 2 count. Certainly any kind of tension in the service motion is the enemy of feeling the weight of the racquet head as the racquet is held in hand.

Surprisingly, I have been hitting better serves and smoother groundless since being placed on beta blockers( an illegal drug in the Olympics- don’t know about the tour). Many of the great juniors somehow have conquered the mind/ body tension war at an early age. I often have wondered if the “racket changing”phenomenon” seen at he club level is a desperate attempt to feel that racket head weight in different conditions.