The Myth of Hitting Around the Ball

[johnyandell]

Would love to get your thoughts on my article, "The Myth of Hitting Around the Ball"

[klacr]

the tennis edition of myth busters.
Fascinating article, Sometimes when trying to add more depth and shape to my forehand I think about swinging outwards to the ball on a 3D plane. I try to feel myself creating the shape. I often view video of Fernando Verdasco in the stroke archives to get me inspired.

Watching the clips in this article its amazing to see just how little difference there is. which leads me to this next query:
I had heard this statement somewhere and not sure if it is true but figured I would ask the forum. When it comes to the sensitivity of the racquet face, 1 degree of change/difference is equal to 16 feet. Not sure of the context or the origin of this statement but curious if there are measurements.
Great article John. Love this myth busting series.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

[morespin]

I am a teaching pro in Orange County, CA.

I think of this topic like hitting a put in golf. You need to roll the ball in the direction of the cup.

I tell my students to "roll the ball toward the target." To roll the ball you need to make topspin. To make the ball move in the direction of the target, you need the racquet face to face toward the target while you swing toward the target. Problem solved

There's a big difference between hitting the ball toward the target and rolling the ball toward the target.

There is almost immediate improvement in the stroke mechanics and shot quality when a player uses this method.

Tim Ludeke, USPTA

[johnyandell]

I like it!

[klacr]

I am a teaching pro in Orange County, CA.

I think of this topic like hitting a put in golf. You need to roll the ball in the direction of the cup.

I tell my students to "roll the ball toward the target." To roll the ball you need to make topspin. To make the ball move in the direction of the target, you need the racquet face to face toward the target while you swing toward the target. Problem solved

There's a big difference between hitting the ball toward the target and rolling the ball toward the target.

There is almost immediate improvement in the stroke mechanics and shot quality when a player uses this method.

Tim Ludeke, USPTA

Tim,
What a great classic tip. Thanks for sharing. Beneficial for students to get the visual and the feel of it. Great having you on the forum. Please continue to contribute.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

[don_budge]

I think of this topic like hitting a put in golf. You need to roll the ball in the direction of the cup.

Tim Ludeke, USPTA

Tennis...is golf on the run.

[morespin]

Thanks, John, Kyle, and Don.

My goal is to use a swing thought that accomplishes as many correct technical things as possible. It's much easier to use a swing thought than all of the individual technical elements. A swing thought like this one is pretty to use in a match. It can keep your mind focused on something useful that also takes care of a lot of technical elements.

I used to coach a girl whose mom had played on the LPGA. We were talking about shaping shots, using different clubs, where you wanted to land the ball, differences in swings to produce different trajectories and bounces, etc.

I told her we (tennis players) have to do all of those things with one racquet that we have to swing on both sides of our bodies, make similar assessments and make similar decisions in a couple of seconds or less while having to run to get into the right position/ stance and then execute the proper stroke on a moving ball!

She was stunned. She asked "how do people even play tennis?" If you consider all of the variables a tennis player has to calculate and adapt to and then execute a technically good stroke with a specific purpose while moving around the court, it is seems like a human shouldn't even be able to play tennis.

Tennis is hard!

[arturohernandez]

Tim,
What a great classic tip. Thanks for sharing. Beneficial for students to get the visual and the feel of it. Great having you on the forum. Please continue to contribute.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

It is funny how rolling gives us such a different image. I mean the ball is in the air. Sometimes we have to jump. So the tendency is to want and try to smack it.

I remember hearing a very famous pro for the LTA in England talk about accelerating after contact. Or we could think of grabbing the ball and throwing it with the strings.

But all this happens in a flash and so there is no way to really do this consciously. Our conscious mind can only give some hints and then watch as our bodies do what they do best.

Again, this is back to John's idea of visual tennis (yes, I have the book!) from long ago.

We have to see something and then try to make the ball do that. Then somehow it happens.

Tennis is awe inspiring to say the least!

[kenh]

Hitting for the lower outside corner of the ball is a valid teaching comment. It has been used by and thought of by great players for a long time. Tilden spoke of it in his books. This concept is used as a counter measure for someone who makes contact with the ball and has the hand going forward slightly before the racquet (jammed). Hitting the lower outside corner concept gets the racquet head below the ball and utilizes the leverage advantage of the racquet by getting the racquet tip of the racquet going forward ahead of the hand after contact. May not be factual all the time but sometimes it is very effective.

[Error]

I am a teaching pro in Orange County, CA.

I think of this topic like hitting a put in golf. You need to roll the ball in the direction of the cup.

I tell my students to "roll the ball toward the target." To roll the ball you need to make topspin. To make the ball move in the direction of the target, you need the racquet face to face toward the target while you swing toward the target. Problem solved

There's a big difference between hitting the ball toward the target and rolling the ball toward the target.

There is almost immediate improvement in the stroke mechanics and shot quality when a player uses this method.

Tim Ludeke, USPTA

I think this is a great way to think about it.

What actually happens and what we feel is happening are often two different things. On a slice you may not be going around the ball but its been a very successful way of teaching a slice for 4 or 5 decades. Actually as you think about it, on slice the initial contact is exactly what you would do if you could go around the ball so in a since you are starting to go around the ball but the ball is gone before you can finish going around it if that makes sense.

[doctorhl]

Another possible swing thought——Position yourself to hit a feed down-the-line to the right corner. Now, think of hitting a similar placed feed by hitting down the line to the left corner. Cross court thought let’s you hit around the ball with incorrect racket approach.

[nickw]

Watching the clips in this article its amazing to see just how little difference there is. which leads me to this next query:
I had heard this statement somewhere and not sure if it is true but figured I would ask the forum. When it comes to the sensitivity of the racquet face, 1 degree of change/difference is equal to 16 feet. Not sure of the context or the origin of this statement but curious if there are measurements.
Great article John. Love this myth busting series.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

Not sure on the measurements Kyle, but it's clear the sensitivity is very high. What the high speed footage explains beautifully in this article is the classic scenario when you aim a ball cross-court, and it ends up going down the line because you are fractionally late at contact. The video clips show the margins are very small! For the same reason, many balls aimed down the line end up quite wide of the mark, so a great example of one of the reasons why hitting cross-court is the high percentage choice. If you're late at contact, the ball still goes in!

[nytennisaddict]

I am a teaching pro in Orange County, CA.

I think of this topic like hitting a put in golf. You need to roll the ball in the direction of the cup.

I tell my students to "roll the ball toward the target." To roll the ball you need to make topspin. To make the ball move in the direction of the target, you need the racquet face to face toward the target while you swing toward the target. Problem solved

There's a big difference between hitting the ball toward the target and rolling the ball toward the target.

There is almost immediate improvement in the stroke mechanics and shot quality when a player uses this method.

Tim Ludeke, USPTA

stealing this tip thx, that's a good visualization to give students

[nytennisaddict]

Hitting for the lower outside corner of the ball is a valid teaching comment. It has been used by and thought of by great players for a long time. Tilden spoke of it in his books. This concept is used as a counter measure for someone who makes contact with the ball and has the hand going forward slightly before the racquet (jammed). Hitting the lower outside corner concept gets the racquet head below the ball and utilizes the leverage advantage of the racquet by getting the racquet tip of the racquet going forward ahead of the hand after contact. May not be factual all the time but sometimes it is very effective.

agreed, some tips if taken literally, don't make sense,... but could be very helpful in breaking a habit/ingrained neural pathway of a student.
common pattern i try to break, is when a student tries to skim the net... i can say "low to high" or "get more under and swing up"... but their old pattern is hard to break... but when i tell them to literally hit the ball over the fence, they have to do something very different...

[morespin]

nytennisaddict, how has the tip worked for you?

I find that it works for 99% of the students I work with. It's so simple and super effective. It de-clutters the player's mind of all of the technical swing thoughts.