A New Teaching System: Forehand: Body Rotation

[seano]

In my experience, squaring the shoulders at contact is especially true on high balls, make sure the opposite arm opens and allows for a longer lever. Too many people block the rotation with the opposite arm. On wide balls, the proper footwork pattern and recovery helps greatly with efficiency and explosiveness but still squared up and reverse finish can allow for tremendous shot making.

[seano]

On extremely wide balls, when you're on the dead run, squaring up probably won't be possible. At best, you may only be able to manipulate your hands.

[don_budge]

A Little Potpourri...of Good Vibrations

Engineering versus Evolution...

The video itself is great. It really captures the object of the lesson.

In fact...the entire series of "A New Teaching System" has been an excellent lesson in the fundamentals of "Modern Tennis". The amazing thing that they haven't changed one iota...except for factoring in the size of the racquet and various and sundry engineering that the "Ministry of Tennis" has imposed on the tennis world. Not one Fundamentally Incorrect (FI) statement in the whole series. When taken in context with the writings of Bill Tilden and the teaching system of Welby Van Horn...it doesn't lose any of its luster or make any contradictions. There is nothing new under the sun. The series is true to its subject. The video analysis does give it another perspective...doesn't it?

I personally think equipment is responsible for many technical changes. My theory is that players used milder forehand grips back in the days of wood not just because grass court tennis with its lower bounce was more prevalent, but maybe also because keeping the racket on edge during the swing gave you a better chance of middling the ball. You would think hitting a forehand like Federer does with a wooden racket, even for Federer, might produce a lot of shanks...though I would love to see him try.

Nice post, 10splayer. It's great to see you making a post again. We've missed you.

Stotty

I think a lot of people may be surprised at the number of shanks and more profoundly...complete misses. Keeping the racquet on edge exposes the maximum amount of racquet face to the ball...much more important when playing with 65 square inches than the zillion they play with these days.

Don_Budge is a golfer (and a baseball man), so he understands what I mean by clean sounding work.

With these new rackets, it's hard for coaches - players to understand clean work, unless they have played - coached sports like hockey, MMA, baseball or golf.

A hockey puck being shot is exact, a golf shot is ever more so, and in baseball the good players emit vibrations that tell you a lot.

A blind man could walk into a boxing gym and pick out the best boxers.

"Clean sounding work"...I certainly like the sound of that. Vibrations...good vibrations. That is coaches speak. Ben Hogan talked of each golf shot sending a vibration from the head of the club through the shaft straight to the heart of the golfer...every shot was a message...an analysis of work done. It used to be a game of feel. The wood was transmitting...the player receiving. But it's so much better now that the feel has been eliminated from the game. Much like feeling has been eliminated from life. Robots!

[hockeyscout]

A Little Potpourri...of Good Vibrations

I think a lot of people may be surprised at the number of shanks and more profoundly...complete misses. Keeping the racquet on edge exposes the maximum amount of racquet face to the ball...much more important when playing with 65 square inches than the zillion they play with these days.

"Clean sounding work"...I certainly like the sound of that. Vibrations...good vibrations. That is coaches speak. Ben Hogan talked of each golf shot sending a vibration throughout the entire golfers body...every shot was a message...an analysis of work done. It used to be a game of feel. The wood was transmitting...the player receiving. But it's so much better now that the feel has been eliminated from the game. Much like feeling has been eliminated from life. Robots!

Appreciate the feedback don_budge.

I hear it. I see it. The old pros who have played hockey, baseball, old school wood racket tennis, ect, they get it. It's easy see and hear. Hopefully our athletes understand feel, as that is a position you try and put them into as players.

Baseball did a good job of controlling the bat suppliers.

Hockey did a bad job as well in preserving our heritage. Kids have these $400 sticks now, and can fire the puck a ton. But, these new sticks result in them not having great control like the old wood ones, and its real tough to take a hard pass. What I see in hockey now is not really human ability, but more good technology of the sticks. As a coach, you have to be careful to have the same old exacting standards as you did when they had wood and you had to earn a wrist shot and slap shot the old fashioned way - through a lot of trial and error till you got just the right feel for the sweet spot. Now the sweet spot on a stick is so much bigger, and you can get away with not exactly being exact.

I worked with a kid who peaked out at the number two Junior U16 player in the country, and he could not believe I know where every shot of his would go before he even hit the ball. I understood in about five minutes how his body worked, and before he even hit the ball I would know the end result. And, he's taken a beating on the pro level because the older pro's can read him a mile away just like I did, and neutralize his game. As they say in hockey, a good player has the best fundamentals away from the puck. Same in tennis. What work is a player doing away from the ball? Just ignore the hitting, and see, how do they get to position? Thats all you need to know. The rest generally takes care of itself as most players in this sport have good hand - eye coordination, and solid rotator cuffs if they are at a world class standard.

This Junior tennis player I am talking about loved to hit the ball (I told him all the time he was simply practicing catch, like in baseball), and he'd have to focus more on (a) getting to position on the ball and (b) properly using the momentum of his swing - finish to put himself in prime time position for the next ball instead of continually cancelling himself out.

His rhythm count would always be 1-1-1-1 and I wanted it to flow 1-3-5-7. That's the issue with these endless rallies that the McEnroe led USTA believed in - and, its not tennis. You get guys who can slug a ball, but, when they have to flow, evade, move in, back off, transition, take it on the rise, ECT, that's tough. McEnroe, the former head of the tennis federation used to say good players need to rally 50 times in a row. That was just crazy to me. It is just playing meaningless catch back and forth.

I think I was proven right when people really started to track stats in tennis - one guy did a nice article here about rally times in pro tennis (and, I knew that from day one when I started).

Anyways, on the pro tour, he was always behind because he had no understanding of how to play the short points the game required to win at that level. And, that is the issue with all this baseline bashing. In the old days I imagine guys would practice hitting a ground stroke, moving in, volleying, and finishing the point. They'd have a great rhythm for the game. Now, that's flows not quite there, and its a habit I am really conscientious about building in an old school kind of way.

Agassi was the best at transitioning from shot to shot in my opinion of any tennis player I have ever seen - his ability to flow out of a shot, stop and start was second to none (his dad was an Olympic boxer, so that is the one element they hit the nail on the head, in MMA it is all about combinations, and sequencing what you do from one thing, to the next, without buckling or losing your flow and rhythm).

The guys who were five or six sport athletes (hockey, golf, track - field, boxing, MMA, soccer, basketball have a real advantage in tennis because so many elements of those games can be transitioned over.

I've been watching a lot of the golf stuff lately, its really amazing what the players and coaches bring to the table in terms of technical expertise. You listen to the old golfers talk like Hogan, and its amazing how much they know about their sport in comparison to us hockey players who kind of do things without maybe clearly understanding why we do it.

[Guest]

Golf on the Run...

I hear it. I see it. The old pros who have played hockey, baseball, old school wood racket tennis, ect, they get it. It's easy see and hear. Hopefully our athletes understand feel, as that is a position you try and put them into as players.

Baseball did a good job of controlling the bat suppliers.

Hockey did a bad job as well in preserving our heritage. Kids have these $400 sticks now, and can fire the puck a ton. But, these new sticks result in them not having great control like the old wood ones, and its real tough to take a hard pass. What I see in hockey now is not really human ability, but more good technology of the sticks. As a coach, you have to be careful to have the same old exacting standards as you did when they had wood and you had to earn a wrist shot and slap shot the old fashioned way - through a lot of trial and error till you got just the right feel for the sweet spot. Now the sweet spot on a stick is so much bigger, and you can get away with not exactly being exact.

I've been watching a lot of the golf stuff lately, its really amazing what the players and coaches bring to the table in terms of technical expertise. You listen to the old golfers talk like Hogan, and its amazing how much they know about their sport in comparison to us hockey players who kind of do things without maybe clearly understanding why we do it.

Baseball could not make the transition...they would have if they could have. But they would have to change the dimensions of the ballparks. The hockey stick is another change that sets up the game for changes that are not perceptible to the untrained eye. But those that know understand the difference.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeF6kvbKDeY

Golf is the gold standard regards technique. The nature of the sport demands this sort of attention to detail. Ben Hogan wrote a book called "The Five Fundamentals of Golf". Every tennis coach should probably read it. Having "mastered" both sports I have come to the conclusion that tennis is golf on the run. The description of the body rotation on the golf swing is very useable with regards to the tennis swings. Brilliant stuff from Ben Hogan.

[don_budge]

Golf on the Run...

I hear it. I see it. The old pros who have played hockey, baseball, old school wood racket tennis, ect, they get it. It's easy see and hear. Hopefully our athletes understand feel, as that is a position you try and put them into as players.

Baseball did a good job of controlling the bat suppliers.

Hockey did a bad job as well in preserving our heritage. Kids have these $400 sticks now, and can fire the puck a ton. But, these new sticks result in them not having great control like the old wood ones, and its real tough to take a hard pass. What I see in hockey now is not really human ability, but more good technology of the sticks. As a coach, you have to be careful to have the same old exacting standards as you did when they had wood and you had to earn a wrist shot and slap shot the old fashioned way - through a lot of trial and error till you got just the right feel for the sweet spot. Now the sweet spot on a stick is so much bigger, and you can get away with not exactly being exact.

I've been watching a lot of the golf stuff lately, its really amazing what the players and coaches bring to the table in terms of technical expertise. You listen to the old golfers talk like Hogan, and its amazing how much they know about their sport in comparison to us hockey players who kind of do things without maybe clearly understanding why we do it.

Baseball could not make the transition...they would have if they could have. But they would have to change the dimensions of the ballparks. The hockey stick is another change that sets up the game for changes that are not perceptible to the untrained eye. But those that know understand the difference.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GeF6kvbKDeY

Golf is the gold standard regards technique. The nature of the sport demands this sort of attention to detail. Ben Hogan wrote a book called "The Five Fundamentals of Golf". Every tennis coach should probably read it. Having "mastered" both sports I have come to the conclusion that tennis is golf on the run. The description of the body rotation on the golf swing is very useable with regards to the tennis swings. Brilliant stuff from Ben Hogan.

[stotty]

My understanding of elastic energy and the stretch-shortening cycle, along with Brian Gordon's research. The firing of the hips (or separation) is a more subtle movement, which initiates the lag effect. This subtle lag creates torque and everything that follows is set into motion and intensifies. Once the shoulders are square to the net, their job is done (for the most part). If you've done the Type 3 forehand correctly, the final 90% of rotation is caused by the independent movement of the arm (a key element in Brian's research). That finishes with the right shoulder pointing towards the target. If you watch some of Federer's forehand in super slow-mo, it's incredible how the body quiets once the shoulders are facing the net and the arm accelerates to complete the rotation, a thing of beauty.

Great post, seano...eloquent stuff.

I think John has a point when he says "how does this happen"?. As coaches how can we ensure our more talented students fire the hips correctly? What should a player focus on to make it happen? What should a coach say and do to make it happen?

I think coaching these days is a three way road. You have people like Brian Gordon delivering the science, you have the coach, and you have the student. Brian Gordon's work is fruitless if coaches cannot convey and teach it in ways that can be interpreted accurately by students then put into practice. Coaches have to find ways to make pennies drop. I seem to remember Brian saying in one of his articles that ultimately it comes down to coaching intuition to deliver and find ways to make the science happen. There are few silver bullets for difficult problems in coaching. You need a big tool bag and an intuitive teaching brain if we are ever going to be any good at this lark.

I once levelled with a girl who had a problematic serve. I threw time out of the window (as in my hourly rate) and told her we were (note I use "we") going to tackle her serve until we solved the problem and mapped a way forward. I told her I wasn't sure which means would work the best and I would be experimenting, and if she had patience and stamina we would succeed. By the end of the morning we had cracked it.

I was lucky in that the girl was a free spirit and open-minded about coaching. Plus no one had been able to help her with her serve until the point. She had given up. Which is always a good point for coach to step in, oddly enough.

Does she have a great serve now? No, but it works and doesn't let her down anymore? Sometimes player and coach must accept a shot isn't there. Insisting there is would be to imply every girl has the potential to serve like Serena.

And, yes, Federer's forehand in slow motion is probably the most beautiful sight there is in tennis.

Stotty

[seano]

Particularly with juniors, I will introduce a rotational swing with swivel discs. It's very interesting to learn how inportant the hips really are on all the strokes. The hips initiate the shoulder turn in preparation causing the initial lag. And again when they open up to really get your momentum firing. I often use the term "waggle" to describe it.

[10splayer]

Particularly with juniors, I will introduce a rotational swing with swivel discs. It's very interesting to learn how inportant the hips really are on all the strokes. The hips initiate the shoulder turn in preparation causing the initial lag. And again whWhaen they open up to really get your momentum firing. I often use the term "waggle" to describe it.

What do you mean, by "the hips initiate the shoulder turn in prep causing the initial lag?

[seano]

10s player -

I have found that if your initial movement is only the shoulder turn, then you are not engaging the legs and hips. There's a very subtle hip turn first before the shoulder turn that iniates the lag effect that allows you to create, store, then release energy. After the shoulder turn, the hips open first to create even more torque in the core and the elastic energy is further stretched creating even more effortless power. The work of these opposing forces allows for a smooth and relaxed motion. I noticed this effect more and more when I used the swivel discs and was amazed how quickly my students picked it up. All ages and abilities.

Sean

[doctorhl]

What is a swivel disc and where do you get one? I saw a YouTube video to make a homemade swivel disc to initiate the hips in golf. After a year layoff from surgery, I reworked my strokes from old school, linear, wood racket eastern forehand. It took about 10 years to unlearn the motor memory and move to the semi western Rotary swing. I just now mastered the feel of the small hip turn to initiate the lag in shoulder turn. I increased my power by 25 to 30 % and could hit it harder( with equivalent control)then I could when playing in college. But I eventually blew two lumbar discs because I think the muscles were not trainable at age 60 to learn a new motor path with the increased power.

[seano]

Swivel discs are just round discs that rotate. I got mine at oncourtoffcourt.com. These are plastic ones, you can find more expensive, better quality ones on the internet.

[don_budge]

Golf on the Run...

Golf is the gold standard regards technique. The nature of the sport demands this sort of attention to detail. Ben Hogan wrote a book called "The Five Fundamentals of Golf". Every tennis coach should probably read it. Having "mastered" both sports I have come to the conclusion that tennis is golf on the run. The description of the body rotation on the golf swing is very useable with regards to the tennis swings. Brilliant stuff from Ben Hogan.

http://lessons.squaretosquaremethod.com/lessons/xe1-members/timing-of-hips-in-downswing/?utm_source=sq-internal&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=sq-internal-xe1-content&utm_content=sq-internal-xe1-content-timing-of-hips-downswing

[Guest]

There are so many technicalities on the forehand that even experienced coaches forget. John Yandell reminds us all about the torso rotation and all other body parts that combine to drive through the forehand. Once again, great video, and the explanation is quite simple and effective. Well done John.

[johnyandell]

Thank you much!