2016 U. S. Open Championships...ATP 2000...New York, New York, USA

[don_budge]

Sock it to me...

Sock is looking like a contender for this thing. That forehand is really dominating rallies. It reminds me of an in form Nadal, not technique wise, but how once he get his feet set on one, he is really having his way most of the time

Jack Sock doesn't remind me of anyone...certainly not Rafael Nadal like you say technique wise. His forehand is even more of a one shot knockout. Nadal did more maneuvering of his opponent. One big forehand seems to knock the racquet out of the hands of the opponent. He is sort of phenom in and of himself. Truly unique.

The Ugly American...my great friend and manager of some of the most beautiful hotels on the islands of Hawaii doesn't care for Sock a lot. He doesn't like the backwards baseball cap routine which I have to admit is stupid as well. I don't care how many people do it. I call him "The Ugly American" because when he came to visit in Europe a couple of years ago his criticism of European accommodations was so caustic and Amerocentric. He doesn't like Donald Trump either...though I find that funny because for all of his reasons there are many similarities between the two. That could very explain why I like the both of them very much. The Ugly American is an American phenom as well...currently undergoing chemotherapy on The Big Island.

[stotty]

I saw Sock at Wimbledon this year. Grass certainly isn't his surface, but considering that, he played well. He is certainly a physical specimen too which in part explains the whopping forehands he can produce. He needs time on that forehand, though....more time than Nadal. In the match I saw that day he hit most returns flat simply because he has to be in position early and set up to pump out plenty of RPMs. Nadal by contrast can hit heavy topspin of seemingly everything and anything and from anywhere.

But like stroke suggested, once Sock has the upper hand and starts dictating in rallies, he is a beast to deal with, no question.

I like Sock. I find him a little different.

Stotty

[stotty]

Del Potro played extremely well in his last set against Ferrer. Seeing it like a football and blasting forehands at warp speed. He time-wastes like no one else on the tour, however. He was taking close to a minute sometimes after the longer rallies.

Stotty

[don_budge]

2016 U. S. Open...Round of Sixteen

Sock is looking like a contender for this thing. That forehand is really dominating rallies. It reminds me of an in form Nadal, not technique wise, but how once he get his feet set on one, he is really having his way most of the time

A contender? Hmmm...that's interesting. stroke wrote this before Sock's match with a previous U. S. Open champion, Marin Cilic. Jack be nimble...Jack be quick...Jack sent him home with a spanking stick!

No doubt about that, more ways than one. Big picture though, Ryan needs to think about maybe what he can do to bring that kind of effort and focus more regularly.

Ryan ran into a guy that always plays like his opponent wants to steal his girlfriend. Marcos Baghdatis is one tough and ornery hombre. He looks like an angry Mexican sometimes. A real bandito.

Del Potro played extremely well in his last set against Ferrer. Seeing it like a football and blasting forehands at warp speed.

Stotty

If they aren't seeing it or feeling it at this point they are headed home. The round of sixteen coming and only eight deserve to be in the quarters.

Djokovic or Edmund? Kyle should certainly just be happy to be there but he has other thoughts. A big upset in his dreams? If he cannot dream it, most likely he cannot do it. He took down one very big guy in John Isner and another big fish in Richard Gasquet...Djokovic is not so big but he can be huge.

Sock or Tsonga? stroke's question of the day. Which Tsonga is going to show up? The one that narrowly beat Sock a year ago on clay? A lot of river has flowed under the bridge since...Sock playing on home soil. It sure would be nice to see an American playing in the quarterfinals of the U. S. Open...if that isn't being too nationalistic. Sock it to 'em!

Nadal or Rouille? A little Parisian magic...or more of the butt-pulling robotic ticks of the neurotic one. Probably more butt-pulling ticks.

"The Amazing Mr. Monfils" or Baghdatis? None other than...you know who!

Things are shaping up...it is Jack Sock in the match of the day. Here is a golden opportunity to show that he belongs. Is he up to the challenge? Will the "Baby Bull" put up maximum resistance?

[stroke]

2016 U. S. Open...Round of Sixteen



A contender? Hmmm...that's interesting. stroke wrote this before Sock's match with a previous U. S. Open champion, Marin Cilic. Jack be nimble...Jack be quick...Jack sent him home with a spanking stick!



Ryan ran into a guy that always plays like his opponent wants to steal his girlfriend. Marcos Baghdatis is one tough and ornery hombre. He looks like an angry Mexican sometimes. A real bandito.



If they aren't seeing it or feeling it at this point they are headed home. The round of sixteen coming and only eight deserve to be in the quarters.

Djokovic or Edmund? Kyle should certainly just be happy to be there but he has other thoughts. A big upset in his dreams? If he cannot dream it, most likely he cannot do it. He took down one very big guy in John Isner and another big fish in Richard Gasquet...Djokovic is not so big but he can be huge.

Sock or Tsonga? stroke's question of the day. Which Tsonga is going to show up? The one that narrowly beat Sock a year ago on clay? A lot of river has flowed under the bridge since...Sock playing on home soil. It sure would be nice to see an American playing in the quarterfinals of the U. S. Open...if that isn't being too nationalistic. Sock it to 'em!

Nadal or Rouille? A little Parisian magic...or more of the butt-pulling robotic ticks of the neurotic one. Probably more butt-pulling ticks.

"The Amazing Mr. Monfils" or Baghdatis? None other than...you know who!

Things are shaping up...it is Jack Sock in the match of the day. Here is a golden opportunity to show that he belongs. Is he up to the challenge? Will the "Baby Bull" put up maximum resistance?

No surprise here, I think he is ready. He really does have a similar game to Tsonga. Both of them clearly try to run around and hit as many forehands as possible. No surprise here again, I think Sock's is better. Serves about even, both with good serves. Backhands about even to me, neither has a great 2 hander by todays standard, and netiher has a great backhand slice. Both big, strong players. Sock with better movement to me at this point in their careers. I see the Sock forehand once again as the biggest shot on the court. And I see a frustrated Tsonga.

[stroke]

Sock it to me...



Jack Sock doesn't remind me of anyone...certainly not Rafael Nadal like you say technique wise. His forehand is even more of a one shot knockout. Nadal did more maneuvering of his opponent. One big forehand seems to knock the racquet out of the hands of the opponent. He is sort of phenom in and of himself. Truly unique.

The Ugly American...my great friend and manager of some of the most beautiful hotels on the islands of Hawaii doesn't care for Sock a lot. He doesn't like the backwards baseball cap routine which I have to admit is stupid as well. I don't care how many people do it. I call him "The Ugly American" because when he came to visit in Europe a couple of years ago his criticism of European accommodations was so caustic and Amerocentric. He doesn't like Donald Trump either...though I find that funny because for all of his reasons there are many similarities between the two. That could very explain why I like the both of them very much. The Ugly American is an American phenom as well...currently undergoing chemotherapy on The Big Island.

I like your point here. I also feel the Sock forehand is even more of a one shot knockout than Nadal's, and that is saying something. Nadal's forehand was the main component in all those French Open titles, to me the most impressive feat ever, 9 of 10. Technique wise, and this is obviously just an opinion, nothing remotely quantitative here, but it appears to me that Sock tends to maybe attack more the inside of the ball on his forehands, where Nadal tends to attack more the outside of the ball, creating his signature hook topspin. I have seen Sock play up very close twice and his forehands jumping off the court I would say are almost all "kick" forehands(similar maybe to attacking the inside of the ball on a kcik serve). Seeing those fh's kick off the court in person, tv does not do it justice. I have never seen Nadal play a match up close, he obviously does not get any matches on the outside courts at tournaments. Sock to me has a more western grip also, so western that he could not really hit a straight arm forehand even if he wanted to. Nadal's straight arm forehand, with the accompanying extra extension to the ball, may make it easier to attack the outside of the ball. Sock's very strong semi western grip may have something to do with the way he to me seems to attack the ball differently from Nadal.

[stotty]

2016 U. S. Open...Round of Sixteen

Nadal or Rouille? A little Parisian magic...or more of the butt-pulling robotic ticks of the neurotic one. Probably more butt-pulling ticks.

Things are shaping up...it is Jack Sock in the match of the day. Here is a golden opportunity to show that he belongs. Is he up to the challenge? Will the "Baby Bull" put up maximum resistance?

Nadal is looking a little more like his old self. Could it be that he is not finished after all? He has had a good draw thus far and yet to be truly tested. Let's see....

Sock has s great opening. I hope he can take advantage of it. For me it's the most interesting match of the last sixteen.

Stotty

[don_budge]

Jack Sock versus Jo-Wilfried Tsonga...Tit for Tat

Technique wise, and this is obviously just an opinion, nothing remotely quantitative here, but it appears to me that Sock tends to maybe attack more the inside of the ball on his forehands, where Nadal tends to attack more the outside of the ball, creating his signature hook topspin.

Backhands about even to me, neither has a great 2 hander by todays standard, and netiher has a great backhand slice.

Interesting thoughts...stroke.

You no doubt are aware of my rhetorical question to the student...what is power? The answer...control Control is power. Control having the three main elements of speed, spin and placement.

Both Rafael Nadal and Jack Sock possess what one might say are very "powerful forehands". But what is it that makes them so powerful? Your point about the nine French Open wins of Nadal is an excellent point to examine the question about the Nadal forehand. What makes it so powerful on the red clay that he is virtually unbeatable. First of all...just imagine the amount of control that he exerted for nine French Open trophies. The consistency...the ability to get the ball in play as many times as it takes. Obviously the Nadal forehand is not all about speed. No matter what it appears to be everything about that forehand is about the relative amount of speed...and spin...and placement that makes his forehand so powerful. It isn't just speed with Nadal but it is the tremendous amount of spin or "hook" as you put it that he puts on the ball and also perhaps a little less obvious is his ability to place the ball. He spends a lot of energy getting that ball high up on the right handers backhand in the backhand corner to open up the forehand side for his "reverse cross court" as I like to call it. Nadal is also content to stay back behind the baseline and duel for as many balls as it takes with the confidence that it isn't going to be him that is going to miss.

Jack Sock on the other hand with his tremendous attack on the inside of the ball is going to have to attribute mostly speed to the power of his shot. The amount and type of spin is of course a factor of his grip and how his racquet face passes through the path of the ball. His forehand is not going to stand up to the severe test that it would take to capture nine French Opens in a row...even if everything else is equal. The Sock forehand does not have nearly the margin for error that the Nadal forehand has. This is the key to the difference...the built in margin for error. Sock might have some wonderful and spectacular days when everything is going right and perhaps the wind is not swirling around...but the question is will that rather "interesting" swing of his stand up to the test of three out of five for the course of two weeks. What is going to happen to him if one day he isn't "feeling it"? This is his existential question. Then it comes down to his opponents...what kind of power does the opponent have against the all out aggression of Sock. Does he have sufficient control...vis a vis spin and placement to go along with enough speed to upset the Sock apple cart? What is Sock's plan B? Therein lies the problem for Sock to be the contender of a Grand Slam number one and number two...to be a repeated contender in Grand Slam after Grand Slam. I feel that he is hindered by a lack of control.

Another very interesting point that you have made and perhaps you haven't truly thought about this one either. When I was watching those highlights between Sock and Cilic I was struck by the one hand backhand slice of Sock. This is another "interesting" shot in the Jack Sock repertoire. I am really looking forwards to getting a better look at it in his match against Jo-Wilfried Tsonga. This is a very interesting match based on all of the things that we have speculated about. All of the relative strengths and weaknesses of both players. Then the question is going to be...who is going to play smarter? Who will have the patience when patience is needed? Who is going to go for it when the situation dictates that?

Thanks for you comments. It makes one think. I think.

[don_budge]

Sock has s great opening. I hope he can take advantage of it. For me it's the most interesting match of the last sixteen.

Stotty

I think that I will call that one a draw...with Dominic Thiem and Juan Martin Del Potro.

[klacr]

Nadal is out. Pouille and Nadal put on quite the performance. Wow.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

[stotty]

[B]

Both Rafael Nadal and Jack Sock possess what one might say are very "powerful forehands". But what is it that makes them so powerful? Your point about the nine French Open wins of Nadal is an excellent point to examine the question about the Nadal forehand. What makes it so powerful on the red clay that he is virtually unbeatable. First of all...just imagine the amount of control that he exerted for nine French Open trophies. The consistency...the ability to get the ball in play as many times as it takes. Obviously the Nadal forehand is not all about speed. No matter what it appears to be everything about that forehand is about the relative amount of speed...and spin...and placement that makes his forehand so powerful. It isn't just speed with Nadal but it is the tremendous amount of spin or "hook" as you put it that he puts on the ball and also perhaps a little less obvious is his ability to place the ball. He spends a lot of energy getting that ball high up on the right handers backhand in the backhand corner to open up the forehand side for his "reverse cross court" as I like to call it. Nadal is also content to stay back behind the baseline and duel for as many balls as it takes with the confidence that it isn't going to be him that is going to miss.

I don't think Nadal's forehand damages like it used to. Or are players just striking the ball harder and taking bigger cuts early on in the rallies? Whatever, his forehand didn't seem to trouble Pouille one jot yesterday.

Nadal is out. Pouille and Nadal put on quite the performance. Wow.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

That was some game. Pouille was sensational the entire match. For one night at least he had the best backhand on the tour. I was dumbfounded by Nadal's tactics of continually playing into it. Nadal's forehand did nothing to dent Pouille's supremacy on that wing. Pouille has everything. His movement and ball striking are simply superb.

I was amazed Pouille didn't step in more on Nadal's serve, particularly on the ad court. He was returning way behind the baseline off relatively tame serves.

It was a great match for ball striking but tactically both players seemed off the mark here and there, no?

Interesting that in the presser Pouille said it was a deliberate tactic to stand way back at the start of the rally then move up to the baseline to take his chances. He felt it was a good tactic.

Stotty

[stroke]

Great determination and ball striking by Pouille. Nadal as we all know does not give in. Tsonga clearly the better player vs Sock. I thought Sock was primed for a run here. Tough ask winning a major. All that constant running around the backhand is so physically demanding and may be a little too 90's for todays game.

[don_budge]

2016 U. S. Open...New York, New York...The Round of 16

Nadal is out. Pouille and Nadal put on quite the performance. Wow.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

The Lone Ranger is out...the three Musketeers are through. Jack Sock flunked his exam against an in form Jo-Wilfried Tsonga. Tsonga almost toyed with the one trick pony as it turns out. Marvelous forehands...at times. But that isn't enough to earn a spot in the quarterfinals of the U. S. Open. One great shot does not a player make and Sock showed deficiency in the rest of his game. The serve is not nearly the weapon that it needs to be. The backhand is apparently so bad that he feels that he must play balls that are nearly landing on his backhand sideline with his forehand. What a strange game modern tennis has evolved to be. It never ceases to amaze me.

Tsonga for his part took care of business. It didn't appear that he showed any particular level of respect or fear of the Sock forehand as he just went into it as he would any other forehand. Sock hit some winners but I would be interested to know what his ratio of unforced errors are. This is the thing about Sock...a definite lack of consistency. Who is going to win the long points more often...this is many times the factor separating the winner from the loser. Tsonga's serve looked to be much more punishing than the Sock delivery. Taking care of business on the serve is paramount. I wasn't impressed with Sock's serve in the least. The motion itself is convoluted and it rhythmically is going to be tough to get that thing to behave the way it should under pressure or even under normal stress. But it passes for a functional serve...in modern tennis.

I don't think Nadal's forehand damages like it used to. Or are players just striking the ball harder and taking bigger cuts early on in the rallies? Whatever, his forehand didn't seem to trouble Pouille one jot yesterday.

It was a great match for ball striking but tactically both players seemed off the mark, no?

Stotty

Rafael Nadal has definitely lost something. It's sort of suspicious how he has sunk so quickly for no good reason. It's as if he is running on fumes...running out of gas. The forehand has lost some of its former sting and how can that be? I think that answer may lie in the question of PED's. Just a sneaking suspicion. It fits the profile.

I watched the first set of the match and it was a great start for the Frenchman. Pouille came right out and took it to him. No hesitation...no second guessing. He played Nadal exactly as Djokovic has played him the last couple of years. A carbon copy. Players are no longer pinned down by the formerly awesome spin of the forehand. He still hits some great shots but he finds himself out of position more often now than he used to. Scrambling to retrieve one hand backhands that he defensively slices back and this is where the opponents are starting to carve him up a bit. Nadal is certainly a strange case. It's hard to figure out...without the information.

Lucas Pouille joins a club of growing numbers...players that beat the once almost invincible Rafael Nadal. Congratulations to the newest member of French Grand Slam Quarterfinalists first. He is a very nice player and I recognized this several years ago when he played Roger Federer at the Paris Indoors. But he isn't really such a dominating force in the game as one would think of as Rafael Nadal. Lucas now has played a total of 19 of a possible 20 sets. He has been pushed to the limits by every player he has faced. Next up for him...countryman "The Amazing Mr. Monfils".

Barring an amazing meltdown Gael Monfils should be able to wear down his compatriot into the molten hard courts of Flushing Meadows. Pouille has had his run and logic tells us he should be satisfied and go home after a polite showing against his amazing compatriot. Not so fast...he has come all of this way and he would like another bite of the Big Apple. It's great for the French to have such a tremendous success on the U. S. soil. It's sort of sad to see that the U. S. tennis deal has sunk so abysmally low. Or has it?

Three French players alive in the top half of the draw. Can they...between the three of them...take down the seemingly invincible Novak Djokovic? He has been showing some signs of a slight weakening. But is it all for show? Psychological warfare? Gamesmanship? He's a master at playing the game...you know.

[stotty]

Jack Sock flunked his exam against an in form Jo-Wilfried Tsonga. Tsonga almost toyed with the one trick pony as it turns out. Marvelous forehands...at times. But that isn't enough to earn a spot in the quarterfinals of the U. S. Open. One great shot does not a player make and Sock showed deficiency in the rest of his game. The serve is not nearly the weapon that it needs to be. The backhand is apparently so bad that he feels that he must play balls that are nearly landing on his backhand sideline with his forehand. What a strange game modern tennis has evolved to be. It never ceases to amaze me.

Tsonga for his part took care of business. It didn't appear that he showed any particular level of respect or fear of the Sock forehand as he just went into it as he would any other forehand. Sock hit some winners but I would be interested to know what his ratio of unforced errors are. This is the thing about Sock...a definite lack of consistency. Who is going to win the long points more often...this is many times the factor separating the winner from the loser. Tsonga's serve looked to be much more punishing than the Sock delivery. Taking care of business on the serve is paramount. I wasn't impressed with Sock's serve in the least. The motion itself is convoluted and it rhythmically is going to be tough to get that thing to behave the way it should under pressure or even under normal stress. But it passes for a functional serve...in modern tennis.

Tsonga clearly the better player vs Sock. I thought Sock was primed for a run here. Tough ask winning a major. All that constant running around the backhand is so physically demanding and may be a little too 90's for todays game.

I was expecting better from Sock. You are both right. Tsonga completely outplayed him and is quite simply a better player. Sock did well to get the third set...more due to Tsonga taking his foot off the gas than anything else. As things stand the best Jack can hope for is a third or fourth round place in a slam.

His forehand isn't reliable enough for what he needs it to do and his defence is weak. Top flight tennis is perhaps as much about defence as it is attack. The top four are all brilliant defenders. It's what's made them all so much better than the rest.

Stotty

[don_budge]

2016 U. S. Open...Donald Trump in the House?

I was expecting better from Sock. You are both right. Tsonga completely outplayed him and is quite simply a better player. Sock did well to get the third set...more due to Tsonga taking his foot off the gas than anything else. As things stand the best Jack can hope for is a third or fourth round place in a slam.

His forehand isn't reliable enough for what he needs it to do and his defence is weak. Top flight tennis is perhaps as much about defence as it is attack. The top four are all brilliant defenders. It's what's made them all so much better than the rest.

Stotty

The Sock/Tsonga match was a dud...more or less. The same can be said for the rest of the matches save the Pouille slaying of Nadal. I can never get enough of watching Rafael Nadal lose. There is something incredibly fake about him. Something contrived...even is a stupid sort of way. He has his appeal with the masses though. I can understand that. I only saw a set of that match but it was time to go to bed and I had a choice between watching the match or hitting the pillow. I don't regret my choice. You can always catch the highlights.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cYCbBPKwnQc

The Monfils/Baghdatis match was a basic bore as well. Monfils completely dominated his opponent and dictated the play. Endless backcourt rallies...Monfils himself is only so entertaining.

I came home from the club hoping to see a Juan Martin Del Potro and Dominic Thiem slugfest and it was disappointing to hear that Thiem had to withdraw due to a problem with his knee. Let's hope that it isn't serious. This was a big time opportunity for Thiem as well...to take on the resurgent Del Potro. A berth in the quarterfinals would have justified his presence in the elite top ten but now he is waiting on the results of his injury diagnosis to see in which direction his career is headed.

Stan Wawrinka played a relatively less experienced Illya Marchenko and he handled the situation accordingly. Stan looked to be a bit feisty as he was demonstrating his dissatisfaction for his own game. Too bad Nick "The Jerk" Kyrgios took a powder and had to default to Marchenko. Kyrgios and Wawrinka was the match to see. Anyone know what happened to Kyrgios...was it something more than getting his feelings hurt? Wawrinka and Del Potro next. Something inside of me is definitely pulling for Del Potro. I think that I have seen Wawrinka play soft too many times when it just didn't matter to him. He appears to be a bit spoiled.

Nishikori and Murray should be the epitome of the dud. Neither of these two could get any of my attention for any foreseeable reason. Andy Murray is the most boring elite player ever. Attitude and game-wise.