Oscar Wegner on the Open Stance...

[don_budge]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=85EFNRihtJk

Oscar Wegner on the Open Stance…below I am paraphrasing what Oscar is advocating in his open stance video. He advocates this because the pros play like this…he ascertains. But I am not convinced. His analogies with baseball and golf are counter intuitive. It seems to me that the same laws of physics, if not metaphysics apply here.

eaglesburg has the same Oscaronian idea about the way that the game is played. In fact…this is the cult that is tennis nowadays. In teaching it seems to me that it is important to teach the Fundamentally Correct (FC) stance first as in slightly closed and basically neutral before proceeding into open stance.

It seems that once the open stance is ingrained in the player it is next to impossible to change it whereas it is quite a simple matter to transition from closed to open. Many of the shots that are played in the course of a match are played from less than perfect circumstances so accommodations must be made in the stance. Then when you begin to discuss the transition game from the backcourt to the net the whole open stance as default stance becomes unraveled. Not that anybody is interested in coming to the net these days.

Recommends going to the side with the weight…instead of forwards. It helps the whole kinetic chain.

The pros are doing it so I would recommend that the amateurs do it as well. I recommend going to the left with the weight so that he learns to play like the pros.

In closed stance you even cross the foot…then the kid is getting the idea of going forwards which occurs in baseball all the time. But I am trying to teach tennis not baseball. The kids learn to incorporate what they learn from baseball to tennis.

If you put him open stance and coming to the left they feel they are going to the ball and across to the left instead of going forwards like they do in baseball.

So it's very important that with kids with baseball experience to make tennis different. It's a new sport…it's not a combination of baseball and tennis. The same for golf…you play sideways. Ok…that's not applied to tennis. So I wouldn't try to assimilate those other things because its a different purpose in the game. A completely different purpose.

Sometimes I find Oscar interesting in his simplistic approach to parts of the game but this take on the stance I cannot buy into at all…particularly when you are discussing starting beginners in this stance. Baseball players and golfers swing from a sideways position all of the time…they don't have much of a choice. Tennis players should swing from a sideways position more often than not if it is all possible. Fundamentally speaking.

Any thoughts or other ideas?

[klacr]

There are many amusing/interesting things Oscar does. And the best thing is, like all other coaches, he is 100% certain he is right.

Its much easier to get a beginner to learn fundamentally correct strokes as they have no bad habits. Taking a player who has hit thousands of forehands in practice and in competitive matches and changing his open stance is not impossible, but certainly much more challenging.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

[stroke]

Oscar and his MTM followers have a thread going on about this on TW. They even drug in John Yandell, who of course had no luck explaining to them what is really going on technique wise in pro tennis. It was kind of like trying to have a discussion with hockeyscout on this message board. I even read some Oscar instruction on the forehand one time that suggested contracting one's bicep as one pulls across the ball to aid in this pull to contact. What can you say to this kind of instruction?

[eaglesburg]

I am switching from my fully open to a semi open.

[bottle]

I am switching from my fully open to a semi open.

Me too.

[bottle]

Oscar and his MTM followers have a thread going on about this on TW. They even drug in John Yandell, who of course had no luck explaining to them what is really going on technique wise in pro tennis. It was kind of like trying to have a discussion with hockeyscout on this message board. I even read some Oscar instruction on the forehand one time that suggested contracting one's bicep as one pulls across the ball to aid in this pull to contact. What can you say to this kind of instruction?

I don't think one should be dogmatic about this. Chris Lewit for instance teaches some of his young students to contract the biceps and no one in this website has ever, or would ever, I think, say that Chris is anything but absolutely great (read him-- he's got a lot of articles, with video, up here).

Personally, I did a lot of experiments with biceps contraction ("scissoring," Geoff Williams called it) and sort of got it to work but then changed to other stuff.

But I cannot categorically dismiss it the way you do. I've always thought of Oscar as a magnet for bigots.

[johnyandell]

Please let's leave Osky off our message boards. It's just a request because you guys can post what you want but it is a waste of time and misleading at least, or worse destructive.

He has no idea what is really happening in pro tennis. The open stance argument he puts forward is ridiculous. As for the biceps thing--can happen situationally but not the norm he thinks.

There are dozens and dozens of other falsehoods or half truths couched in the guise of ultimate gospel throughout his work and his posts and the posts of his zombie followers. Not to mention his claims about his influence over top players. Yes he actually said that he coached David Nalbandian because he was pretty sure Nalbandian had watched Spanish ESPN as a junior when he was commentating. It's that crazy and that's far from the only example.

He claims to have taught Guga his one-handed backhand when that was Larry Pasos.

If you have read much about Scientology you will see that he has the same approach. (And is in fact a scientologist himself.) "I am right and anyone who challenges me is a 'suppressive person.' " Those who challenge him are "persecuting" him. Luckily he is not the ruler of the world or myself and many others would probably be is custody.
The only place even a few people take him seriously is the TW board.

[bottle]

"Osky." That's a good one.

[stroke]

Please let's leave Osky off our message boards. It's just a request because you guys can post what you want but it is a waste of time and misleading at least, or worse destructive.

He has no idea what is really happening in pro tennis. The open stance argument he puts forward is ridiculous. As for the biceps thing--can happen situationally but not the norm he thinks.

There are dozens and dozens of other falsehoods or half truths couched in the guise of ultimate gospel throughout his work and his posts and the posts of his zombie followers. Not to mention his claims about his influence over top players. Yes he actually said that he coached David Nalbandian because he was pretty sure Nalbandian had watched Spanish ESPN as a junior when he was commentating. It's that crazy and that's far from the only example.

He claims to have taught Guga his one-handed backhand when that was Larry Pasos.

If you have read much about Scientology you will see that he has the same approach. (And is in fact a scientologist himself.) "I am right and anyone who challenges me is a 'suppressive person.' " Those who challenge him are "persecuting" him. Luckily he is not the ruler of the world or myself and many others would probably be is custody.
The only place even a few people take him seriously is the TW board.

We need a "like" button here

[bottle]

All ridiculous. But I understand that people must have their villains.

[bottle]

I am switching from my fully open to a semi open.

Me too. And am switching from my square stance (or "neutral") forehand to a square stance forehand with a slight adjustment of rear foot to the right as part of the swing.

The reason in both cases is to extend the range of hip motion. In the semi open at the backswing end. In the square stance at the forward end.

[don_budge]

Is this an order?

Please let's leave Osky off our message boards. It's just a request because you guys can post what you want but it is a waste of time and misleading at least, or worse destructive.

He has no idea what is really happening in pro tennis. The open stance argument he puts forward is ridiculous. As for the biceps thing--can happen situationally but not the norm he thinks.

There are dozens and dozens of other falsehoods or half truths couched in the guise of ultimate gospel throughout his work and his posts and the posts of his zombie followers. Not to mention his claims about his influence over top players. Yes he actually said that he coached David Nalbandian because he was pretty sure Nalbandian had watched Spanish ESPN as a junior when he was commentating. It's that crazy and that's far from the only example.

He claims to have taught Guga his one-handed backhand when that was Larry Pasos.

If you have read much about Scientology you will see that he has the same approach. (And is in fact a scientologist himself.) "I am right and anyone who challenges me is a 'suppressive person.' " Those who challenge him are "persecuting" him. Luckily he is not the ruler of the world or myself and many others would probably be is custody.
The only place even a few people take him seriously is the TW board.

Just a request?

[johnyandell]

Yes.

[bottle]

I would be in favor of joining a crusade against scientologists except for Oscar Wegner, Milton Katselas (drama coach in Hollywood) and the late L. Ron Hubbard himself. These appear the interesting ones. First item of inquiry: Why did Osky move out of the Florida headquarters and return to the left coast?

[curiosity]

I would be in favor of joining a crusade against scientologists except for Oscar Wegner, Milton Katselas (drama coach in Hollywood) and the late L. Ron Hubbard himself. These appear the interesting ones. First item of inquiry: Why did Osky move out of the Florida headquarters and return to the left coast?

It's quite possible OW came to know that CA offers more total benefits to seniors than NY or FL. The dry air, too, is beneficial to many of the elders.