Setting Up the Shoulder Rotations on a World Class Serve

[johnyandell]

Let's discuss Chas Stumpfel's article "Setting Up the Shoulder Rotations on a World Class Serve"

[tennishacker36]

Let's discuss Chas Stumpfel's article "Setting Up the Shoulder Rotations on a World Class Serve"

Where Is The Article?

God Bless,
TennisHacker36

[don_budge]

Look…over there!

Where Is The Article?

God Bless,
TennisHacker36

Look on the left side of the site and you see a list of options…at the very top of the options click on "New Issue".

[klacr]

Good breakdown of the critical components. To be honest, can't think that I ever ponder about any of this stuff while I'm serving. Just toss, turn and hit. But for my students I'm always watching for key movements and this is a great blueprint for what has to happen and what is currently happening.

There is an old line one of my fellow and albeit "shorter" USPTA testers always reminds me of..."never take a serve lesson from a pro over 6ft tall." in other words, a taller teaching pro will never fully know the serving plight of someone much shorter. Although I always have my student's objectives and goals in my mind and I take it seriously, in a moment of lightheartedness, many of my students ask me for that secret tip that will magically make there serve improve in the blink of an eye, I often retort back..."Grow to be 6'6". They always get a good chuckle out of it and we continue with their improvement. One thing I do to help them learn and stress technique and prove to them good serving is still possible I crouch down on one knee. I can still usually pop it pretty well and they feel motivated that at my new "height", a proficient and effective serve is within their grasp if they focus on the fundamentals and control.

Question: On the last clip of Isner serve in article. Is it me or does it seem like at contact he is bent over a bit too much at his waist on this serve?

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

[tennishacker36]

This Is A Brilliant Article!

As Far As Leg Thrust Goes, As You Pointed Out, The Stronger The Force Generated Through The Push Off, The Better Off The Server Will Be. The Reasons Are Three Fold: (1) A Higher Contact Point (2) Transfer Of Energy From Legs Going Upwards, Allowing For A Quicker Hip And Shoulder Rotation Through The Use Of A Faster Firing Of The Oblique (3) More Force Being Generated Upward In A Manner That Will Force The External Rotators Further Back Resulting In A Greater Elastic Stretch, That Will In Turn Produce Increased Force In The Internal Rotators. The Analogy Drawn In The Article Of Accelerating In A Vehicle And The Resulting Feel Of Your Body Being Pressed Back Into The Seat Is What I'm Getting At In Point Three.

God Bless,
TennisHacker36

[jdcremin]

One thing missing I think: the backward bend of the trunk. The backwards lean puts the arm in the best position to achieve stretching of the internal rotators as leg drive begins. Very difficult to achieve this stretching if you're trunk is at 90 degrees as your leg drive begins - also probably will cause shoulder problems. Although, it's possible to injure your shoulder doing it correctly as well because some people have never had their shoulder stretch in this manor - unless they played baseball.

[tennishacker36]

One thing missing I think: the backward bend of the trunk. The backwards lean puts the arm in the best position to achieve stretching of the internal rotators as leg drive begins. Very difficult to achieve this stretching if you're trunk is at 90 degrees as your leg drive begins - also probably will cause shoulder problems. Although, it's possible to injure your shoulder doing it correctly as well because some people have never had their shoulder stretch in this manor - unless they played baseball.

Good Point. Also, The Amount Of Stretch In The Obliques And Abdominals Created By Seperation Between The Shoulder Plane And Hips Is Another Important Factor In Terms Of Total Amount Of Racquet Spoed Generated.

God Bless,
TennisHacker36

[bottle]

The conjecture that external rotation muscles are still at work even after the ball is gone ("the possible final stretching of the external rotators") seems provocative. What would so much delay in the conflict actually do? Or did these little guys give up and then reassert themselves like Napoleon?

[bottle]

I like the materials in this article so very much. Of course there may be a confusion of authorial and editorial presence, but how could that matter when tennis technical clarification is the subject?

Immediately some tactile cues begin to suggest themselves, e.g., one ear to the ball and then the other in the third or tilt-a-whirl stage three stages before somersault, which somersault involves of course delayed wheel hub shift forward.

P.S. In the repeating clip of Isner, IAR happens before and after contact but pronation happens after contact. Just sayin'.

[tennishacker36]

Check out this video on YouTube: 3min video

http://youtu.be/yEpdoAZiHWQ

Though this is a sports science analysis of the 105mph pitcher Chapman, it brings up some interesting points relevant to the service motion, particularly the importance of the speed of firing of the internal rotator cuffs and front deltoids.

God Bless,
TennisHacker36

Just read Yandells argument against comparing pitching to serving. No one would ever say to a pro pitcher you've big a big fast ball... Here's a tennis racquet... Go practice serving... Your fast ball will improve... John wins the argument...

No harm in learning a few interesting tid bits on pitching biomechanics.

[johnyandell]

If If I was doing that article now I would include the similarity in the arm rotations as Chas's articles identify, or the analysis of Sharapova and Murray that I did.

Think of throwing a tennis racket as high in the air as possible. That's a better analogy!

[tennis_chiro]

Importance of fast Internal Shoulder Rotation

Check out this video on YouTube: 3min video

http://youtu.be/yEpdoAZiHWQ

Though this is a sports science analysis of the 105mph pitcher Chapman, it brings up some interesting points relevant to the service motion, particularly the importance of the speed of firing of the internal rotator cuffs and front deltoids.

God Bless,
TennisHacker36

Just read Yandells argument against comparing pitching to serving. No one would ever say to a pro pitcher you've big a big fast ball... Here's a tennis racquet... Go practice serving... Your fast ball will improve... John wins the argument...

No harm in learning a few interesting tid bits on pitching biomechanics.

That clip on Chapman clearly makes the point that you can have significantly faster Internal Shoulder Rotation. And we know from tennis biomechanists that Internal Shoulder Rotation(ISR) contributes about 40% of the speed to a serve. I have my students do my little drills for ISR, but mostly just so they can learn the motion. This makes me think it would even be beneficial to have even my accomplished servers do ISR not just for increased ROM, but also for increased speed in the motion.

I do actually try to get them to do this already, but usually they ignore me. Now I have a video that really shows what improved ISR can do for you.

don

[bottle]

Think of throwing a tennis racket as high in the air as possible.

Combine that tip with this video (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEpd...ature=youtu.be) and YOU'VE GOT IT! No?

[bottle]

"Cartwheel and trunk turn start at the same time." That says to me that the distinctive cartwheel or tilt-a-wheel motion itself is rotating from trunk turn. The hitting shoulder therefore comes around more than it would from either.

[bottle]

In the repeating video of Isner, UAR takes racket both up and down before contact. (Shoot me, but I prefer UAR-- upper arm rotation-- to ISR-- internal shoulder rotation-- to describe the same thing.)