Olefirenkova, 8, Ukraine, strokes!

[10splayer]

first off you need to see it on court. We have the fastest pro court on the challenger tour. It's hard and smooth and nothing takes pace out of the ball. It's way to fast. What you say is correct. But your talking about today's game. 2014 paradym. Tennis. Not sure we are tennis players. No matter what you do for a shot to her or what she receives it will go back hard, deep and a few inches over the net. Inches. Consistently. She is not playing tennis. Here is what I will do - I will hit the heaviest top spin to baseline say twenty feet in the air at top speed on the ball machine so it comes down like a missle and she will pick it up, rock the ball hard like a pro, flat, 1 or 2 inches, throw in a big body fly shot as a tribute to paragan falcon and geoff williams over the net back baseline within inches every time. She is sitting here at dinner laughing cause she wins this bet all the time with guys on the challenger tour. The pro players ask us all the time how she does it and she laughs. When the pro player first play my daughter they can't read what she does and it confuses them because they never see this done delibertly.

The next generation of tennis will be the new.

If only Geoff was here stringing for us. video coming soon boys. The funny thing is she is trying like to dog to slice on the rise on the backhand slice and put it one inch over the and it's impossible to do yet she says she is going to find a way to do it until she dies. We will see, I think it's impossible, however she does something weird each day we have never seen before.

But they will still abide by basic geometry. if the goal is to develop an attacking (flatter,penetratating) groundstrokes, raising the contact height will only allow her to hit it harder and flatter....One can still play the ball on the rise while raising the contact height a bit. And if she is going to be 6 foot 3 or 4, taking advantage of the increased height strike will allow her to flatten out balls that shorter players can't. It's a real tactical/angle advantage, if she doesn't learn to take balls at her shins. Just my 02 cents, and take on some of what Bobby was alluding to.

She's adorable BTW

[lobndropshot]

I see nothing non-traditional about the way she is being developed. She has a tennis racket and she is hitting a tennis ball. I hope you will post more.

Coil as in not face forward as much during the earlier phase of the stroke. I will work on a video. What do you see?

[10splayer]

is in the pudding…6' 1" tall, 180 lbs. 1976. 22 years old.

Come on, that ain't you..way too studly.

[lobndropshot]

You tell me what I am not seeing here please okay? I am likely missing some things, and the help would be appreciated.

I will work on a video.

I like hearing your thoughts because you come at this from a totally different perspective than everyone else who looks at this site. Just like you I have a massive holes in my understanding of this game. I only know enough to know there is a lot I don't know.

Your team is doing a great job with her.

[don_budge]

...

Come on, that ain't you..way too studly.

lol...

[bobbyswift]

Agree with 10s player post. Picking the wrong contact point seems slightly anxious. Need to be slightly calmer relaxed to let ball rise to the right height. On the rise as your seeing it is a misnomer.

[lobndropshot]

With string and equipment the learning curve is steep but totally accessible. I am not saying you will be a Geoff Williams but it will increase your tennis literacy by a lot.

[10splayer]

Thanks for the kind works 10splayer.

Well, bobbyswift and 10splayer, she's intent on breaking ever single law of physics, biomechanics and geometry.

You guys probably have to watch her play on a real tennis court. Things are much different in that environment. This judo mat is slow, and her power is nonexistent. Especially after not playing two weeks and just doing MMA fighting. Probably should not have posted it, however, what the hell, its working good for Kyle isn't it!

Right now she hits it one inch off the ground, it goes over the net by one inch, and hits the one inch in front of the baseline.

It'd be great if you all could sort out why this happens!

I can feed her a hard ground ball and she can pick it up with a full swing, step into it, hit it over the net by a couple inches and do it over and over.

I think we had skill sets that we so challenging in her early years, that playing this way became very natural.

Can't say we know why. We just did it. Well, maybe we did set it up, hell I can't remember, when we get on the court it is a blur, and things just happen.

The young one insists picking it up as fast as she can throws off her opponents timing, and no one can deal with it, especially when she mixes things up and takes balls at her waist, knee, back foot, changes pace and all the rest. She says this one inch shot will be more effective when she is older especially given the fact she will be bigger, people will be hitting it harder to her (she can use their pace) and she's be physically stronger and able to get down into the ultimate fighting position to "execute".

I kind of trust her ability, and instincts. She feels what is right, and does it. Yes, it is likely wrong, however, as you can see she's a rebel, and will only do what feels good, and makes sense for her body.

Anyways boys, feel free to make up a quick video when we get to hit some balls on a real court and tell us what you'd like to see us add into the mix. It'd be great to see some faces to names!

I get it. Let her trust her instincts, be aggressive, have fun with it, enjoy the self exploration/process..etc. There's prob time (at only 8) to iron out any wrinkles..

One thing for sure, she has a very high athletic IQ, and she's gonna be a helluva player.

[GeoffWilliams]

Yesterday I did another string experiment. I went out and tested it against a 20 yr. old guy with atp points, and who recently won $1,200 on a clay court tournament playing doubles. He's short, and about 150 lbs, and a lefty. He is the one who challenged me to a set, not the other way around! I noticed he did not like my twist serve to his back hand, a shot most righties can't hit to a lefty. His serve was also just a spin shot to my back hand, which is my strong side. I won the first 10 points coming into the net on all points. Won the first three games. He then adjusted, and began to hit accurate lobs, and short angle passes and won the next three games and had me down love 40 on my serve in the 7th game. I then adjusted by changing my serve stance location, to show all back hand angle serves, and hit four aces, going wide and wide with heavy slices and short angle kicks. Very short. (I had warmed up with his team mate for about 100 serves so I had the angles down.) Then I adjusted, by faking as if I was going to come in, and stopped short. That gave me an answer to the lobbing. I closed the match out at 6-3 and was too tired to continue, so I played his team mate, a third guy a ten point tie breaker and lost 10-4, but he played a couple of out serves, and I shut down on them. To be fair, he was in a bad car crash, and that limited his movement, but he was the one who challenged me! At 230lbs, and out weighing him by 80lbs, I only won due to that, but he did hit a lot of great shots. My spin off the strings did him in, and any time I needed a point I kept everything high to his back hand.

I strung the mains at 80lbs, and 52/57/62/25lbs down to the third from last cross down, and went up to 52/57/62lbs on the last three crosses with poly star energy. It only lasted for one set, but that's all the top players use a string job for anyway! Lost too much control after that one set. It cost me in the 10 point tie breaker. Vicious spin. Bhb7 is the best string in the world for slice. My twist serves were beating college players. That's not easy to do. They are 4.5 and up. They are in their prime at 19-22 yrs. old and I am almost 60, and fat now. So, the string experiment provided the rpm that they could not handle.

Not easy for a young guy to lose to such an out of shape old one, and he quit and went on to play doubles. Stringing is an expensive joy to me, and I waste a lot of money on one set string jobs! Nothing like it though, and I don't understand why so many people don't understand the importance of the soul, the string.

[tennis_chiro]

Great athlete who took the ball early

One athlete you should study is Elena Dementieva. I don't think I ever saw anyone take the ball any earlier than she did. She should still be playing. She was 6' tall and very fit; didn't seem to have an excess ounce of fat on her. I remember big matches she played when she seemed to be taking the ball almost as early as your daughter is in the clips. Unfortunately she just had an unbelievable case of the yips with her second serve; she couldn't get up over it with topspin and it put her at a terrible disadvantage. I think her struggles with that second serve cost her so many close matches and Grand Slam titles and broke her heart in the process. Sometimes it was painful to watch.

But she is a good example of a successful woman who took the ball very early.

forehand:

http://www.tennisplayer.net/members/strokearchive/pro_woman/elena_dementieva/ed_forehand/ed_fh_center/ed_fh_center.html?EDFHCenterOpenStanceSide1.mov

forehand half-volley (according to listing, but it's on the baseline):

http://www.tennisplayer.net/members/strokearchive/pro_woman/elena_dementieva/ed_forehand/ed_fh_half_volley/ed_fh_half_volley.html?EDFHHalfVolleyCourtLevelRear.mov

backhand:

http://www.tennisplayer.net/members/strokearchive/pro_woman/elena_dementieva/ed_backhand/ed_bh_center/ed_bh_center.html?EDBHCenterOpenStanceSide2.mov

better:

http://www.tennisplayer.net/members/strokearchive/pro_woman/elena_dementieva/ed_backhand/ed_bh_center/ed_bh_center.html?EDBHCenterNeutralStanceSide1.mov

backhand half-volley (again by listing, but from baseline it is not really a half-volley):

http://www.tennisplayer.net/members/strokearchive/pro_woman/elena_dementieva/ed_backhand/ed_bh_halfvolley/ed_bh_halfvolley.html?EDBHHalVCourtLevelRear.mov

2009 Aussie Open highlights with Serena:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zIr_W1GdqSI

don

And, boy, looking at these clips, do I wish we could have helped her with that serve and kept her playing a little longer!

[GeoffWilliams]

She had a worse toss than Ivanovic; that says a lot. Could only serve to the forehand with that far right toss, and what stupidity it was not to hire someone just to teach her how to toss. Not yips, stupidity. When a weakness is so glaringly obvious, and the player ignores it, that is the essence of stupidity. ( The fact that she never corrected it, is proof of the awful lack of work/study/correction.)

Your daughter's weakness is going to be consistency. If she ignores it, she will fail.

[lobndropshot]

Nah, I can't be number one. So, I don't want to try. I don't know how he has patience for it.

I want to listen to my heavy metal music, chew my tobacco, fish, hunt, boxing, weight lift or programing on the computer. I don't have the patience for it. It requires to much thinking, and god, if I had it my young one would make my life hell and be playing with her rackets all day trying new experiments. When she is 12 or 13 I will buy her one!

you can listen to heavy metal, chew tobacco and fish while you string a racket.

[don_budge]

Chip of the Old Block...

Okay this is the edited version. We had a long running conversation here. Me, her, and the hitting partner who was once top 144 in the world.

Her main question, and fair. Do you think this guy knows the service motion better than you, me, or the team we have right now?

I said, well the proof is in the pudding isn't it? You don't know until you've compared his craftsmanship (results) against us, academies and the rest.

So, it led her to three more questions which are fair:

1. Can you send us a few examples of top players serves he's developed? It'd be interesting to see how their serving motions compare. Especially in the 8-10 year old girls category.

2. How do his player stack up in a match? His development program, versus ours, versus everyone else. Any chance we could play a match against his players and see this coaches unique tennis coaching paradigm in action? Maybe you have a tournament we can play in?

3. Has he even seen the player serve? Some kids, just have no upside, and its hard in my opinion to grasp it if someone hasn't seen your service motion. Think, Andre Agassi and Jeremy Bates.

We've never been in Sweden. I wouldn't mind coming their to visit a few of my old hockey buddies, and watch some good Swedish Elite Hockey action.

What do you say? Important questions.

eh?…good luck little one.

[hockeyscout]

eh?…good luck little one.

Ain't no luck involved here.

[GeoffWilliams]

She's very quick, something that also impressed me about sampras. Speed at this age leads to power later on.