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2014 Barclays ATP World Tour Finals…ATP 1500...London, England

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  • #31
    Roger is an all time favourite with our crowd.

    Originally posted by don_budge View Post


    Roger Federer vs. Andy Murray…Here is a match on paper that should be very close with a favored Roger Federer threatened by upset by underdog and hometown favorite Andy Murray. Does it make any difference to Londoners if Andy voted yes or no? Murray certainly has the defensive game to withstand the onslaught of Federer on a sandy laden court but does he have what it takes in the intestinal fortitude variable? Another question is how important is this match to Federer…he can play it soft too when the results don't seem to matter as much.

    Federer is giving us a clinic on preparation these last months. Somehow jockeying his relatively ancient body through the paces of trying to land in the number one position on the tour at the end of the year. It certainly has been a valiant effort win or lose and isn't that what it is all about in the end? Doing your best? I think so. Let the game come to you. That is exactly what he has done. He sprints and fights when he has too then he lets off of the reigns when it makes sense to grab a breath of air and pace himself. So here he is at the pinnacle…against Andy Murray in front of Murray's "hometown" crowd. It would have been "interesting" if the vote had gone to the "yes'"…would Andy still technically have had a hometown crowd. Anyone else thinking along those lines?

    It's ok isn't it? This is a forum?

    Good matches have been none existent so far at this venue at the O2. There could be two good ones tonight.
    I can tell you right now that the crowd will support Andy out of patriotic duty, but deep down they won't take too much encouragement to switch to Federer. Too much whinging and back clutching would certainly see to it. Andy is aware of it too.

    You will not believe how popular Roger is over here in the UK. He is like God in our neck of the world. The only other guy that has ever come close to this kind of reverence was Borg.

    I'm hoping for a humdinger of a match tonight. The tournament needs a shot in the arm. I've given up caring about who wins, I just want to see a thriller.

    And yes it's a forum...anything goes. We should have the right to discuss the undiscussable so long as it is meaningful dialogue. A bit of comedy here and there doesn't go amiss either...
    Last edited by stotty; 11-13-2014, 03:41 AM.
    Stotty

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    • #32
      Andy Murray...

      …cannot buy a first serve. Down 4-0…first set. Roger Federer looking like a million bucks…and then some.
      don_budge
      Performance Analysthttps://www.tennisplayer.net/bulleti...ilies/cool.png

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      • #33
        6-0…Bagel time

        Murray had not been bageled in four years. 6-0 Federer.
        don_budge
        Performance Analysthttps://www.tennisplayer.net/bulleti...ilies/cool.png

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        • #34
          Originally posted by don_budge View Post
          Murray had not been bageled in four years. 6-0 Federer.
          Nearly two bagels in one night...
          Stotty

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          • #35
            He who hesitates is lost...

            Originally posted by don_budge View Post
            As for his upcoming match with Roger he senses just how fit and prepared the Swiss Maestro is at the moment. Federer has gaged every step and every moment since the Parisian debacle against Milos Raonic to arrive in London in the fittest and sharpest of condition. He has gaged it exactly right as he has escalated his performance in the first two matches and still seems to have another gear to shift into. I suspect we will see glimpses of that Thursday against Murray. Here is what Murray had to say and he is measuring his words as he doesn't want to piss off the Swiss Knife any more than he already is.

            “It will be obviously a very difficult match,” said Murray. “But it will be an exciting match. A good one to be part of. I hope I can play well. We've had some very good matches over the years. I hope on Thursday it will be the same.”

            I detect doubt. Whenever I here the word "hope" more than once in a statement it turns out to be pie in the sky. Anybody here remember some unknown pariah preaching "hope and change" to a nation of hopefuls. How about "more of the same"…meet the new boss same as the old boss. I hope Roger pins his ears back. Period.

            Wow!
            I got it right…more thoughts tomorrow.
            don_budge
            Performance Analysthttps://www.tennisplayer.net/bulleti...ilies/cool.png

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            • #36
              One thing that I have always thought about Murray is that he has to let the game come to him. This has always been the case since he was a kid. It's a lifelong characteristic. He has rarely been able to go out all guns blazing from the outset. Some players can do this and some players can't. Murray has to work his way into matches and gradually impose himself on his opponent. I don't understand why he strayed so far away from his usual methodology. In doing so he let the best frontrunner the game has ever seen a gaping great door to bolt through.

              I didn't care who won, I just wanted to see a good game.

              Murray panicked at the job in hand after the first few points and never got out of his panicked state. Federer was sensational but let's face it, he had a lot of help from Murray.

              Federer's post match walk-through of the game with Mark Pecci was one of the most revealing Federer has given. It revealed just how much Federer relies on feel, and the exact stage of the match when he knew everything was working and in place. He hit one extraordinary shot - an inside-in forehand struck with incredible velocity and while still moving laterally around the ball. The shot was sensational and one of the best you could ever see. I cannot imagine what it must be like to time a ball that well. Federer said it was from then onwards he knew he was going to have a great night. There was a sequence of other elements which led up to that "good feeling" but Federer knew from that sensational shot onwards he was all set to be rampant. It's feel first...then confidence.

              At 6-0 2-0, and with Murray still panicking, I told my son it could be 6-0 6-0...I was nearly right. My son, being a Federer fan, wouldn't have cared one bit.
              Last edited by stotty; 11-13-2014, 03:35 PM.
              Stotty

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              • #37
                Beat down city. Federer was ruthless. Murray was listless. I knew it was a going to be a rough day for the Scot when at 2-0 in first set Murray was already jawing at his box. That was uncomfortable to watch.

                Kyle LaCroix USPTA
                Boca Raton

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                • #38
                  So Murray starts the match in the first game and Federer is down 0-30. Hmm, I thought, looks like Federer is in trouble and might lose his serve right at the start. Afterwards, Federer put on a brilliant display of varied shot-making, the best I have ever seen! He displayed every shot in the book: groundstrokes, half-volleys, volleys, serve and volley, chip and charge. Simply devastating, and his 6-0,6-1 with practically no aces!

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                  • #39
                    Peak Performance…coming down to the wire. The Stretch Run!

                    Originally posted by gzhpcu View Post
                    So Murray starts the match in the first game and Federer is down 0-30. Hmm, I thought, looks like Federer is in trouble and might lose his serve right at the start.
                    Oh ye of little faith!…I had the same fleeting thought. Down 0-30…then there was a 35 shot exchange which ended up being the longest of the match. Federer won it but I was left wondering…and not only me Peter Fleming started to hedge his bets a little.

                    Immediately after that point I was wondering to myself could Federer sustain such a pace. My answer was and still is…I doubt that he could. Peter Fleming on the other hand was saying that everyone was saying that Andy Murray was going to have to more aggressive in this match but he was saying he wasn't so certain. Especially after that point. I can understand his doubt.

                    Originally posted by licensedcoach View Post
                    One thing that I have always thought about Murray is that he has to let the game come to him. This has always been the case since he was a kid. It's a lifelong characteristic. He has rarely been able to go out all guns blazing from the outset. Some players can do this and some players can't. Murray has to work his way into matches and gradually impose himself on his opponent. I don't understand why he strayed so far away from his usual methodology. In doing so he let the best frontrunner the game has ever seen a gaping great door to bolt through.
                    I think that this is true about Murray and it is one of his greatest strengths. Against most of the players he can sort of dictate the play at a certain speed of play but when he is up against a player of Federer's pedigree…he is always going to be second when it really counts…as Greg Rusedski opined before the match. Let the game come to you also means that you have to go out and seize the moment and you cannot pussyfoot around and be passive against such an energy as the one Roger Federer possessed this November evening in London.

                    Originally posted by don_budge View Post
                    For Murray's part he may as well be coached by a girl because he really played like a pussy yesterday.
                    When I said that Murray played like a pussy against Nishikori I was merely calling a spade a spade. I stand by what I said. No uncertain terms. Look up pussy in the dictionary. It means one of several things. Either a vulgar term for a woman's genitals or a weak, cowardly, or effeminate man. It could be the informal for a cat. Guess which context I was using. Get a life. It is one thing to counter shots with players that have no more in mind than camping out on the baseline but it is quite another against a player that is trying to disrupt your game by any means necessary. You cannot pussyfoot around with the latter. Murray played like a woman…look for the lesbian coach to disappear.

                    Once and for all Federer is putting on a display and a clinic that demonstrates why the modern game is ineffective and inferior to the classic game. EVery single player from the classic era was capable of playing this kind of tennis…maybe not at the level we witnessed last night but certainly at very high levels. I have seen John McEnroe at that level many, many times and he was also very destructive on the strong gripped forehand, two handed backhand game. The myth of the modern game.

                    Originally posted by don_budge View Post
                    Federer has gaged every step and every moment since the Parisian debacle against Milos Raonic to arrive in London in the fittest and sharpest of condition. He has gaged it exactly right as he has escalated his performance in the first two matches and still seems to have another gear to shift into. I suspect we will see glimpses of that Thursday against Murray. Here is what Murray had to say and he is measuring his words as he doesn't want to piss off the Swiss Knife any more than he already is.

                    “It will be obviously a very difficult match,” said Murray. “But it will be an exciting match. A good one to be part of. I hope I can play well. We've had some very good matches over the years. I hope on Thursday it will be the same.”

                    I detect doubt. Whenever I here the word "hope" more than once in a statement it turns out to be pie in the sky. Anybody here remember some unknown pariah preaching "hope and change" to a nation of hopefuls. How about "more of the same"…meet the new boss same as the old boss. I hope Roger pins his ears back. Period.

                    Wow!
                    The above is what I have really nailed…so far in this tournament. You can say all you want about this, that and the other thing. But this is match play psychology…right out of the book…the Bible of Tennis. Match Play and Spin of the Ball. Tilden is the book. This tournament is the result of weeks of preparation. I would guess that the planning for this was to commence right after the U. S. Open.

                    Roger is now in the midst of his plan as he enters the semifinal phase of operations. He has had the quick match that he needed. He had the peak performance that he was looking for. When he had Murray down he never let up and he was just relentless and ruthless. Just as a tennis player should be…every time he walks out onto the tennis court. Once you reach that point there is no point in pussyfooting around you go for the jugular…and he had Murray by the throat last night. Now he has a day of rest and he can spend the time resting and getting in a hit just to confirm what he now suspects…he is there and he is ready. In the moment. Aaron would say that he is "treeing"…meaning he is in the upper branches looking down on us.

                    Federer sent a message too over on the other half of the draw to Mr. Djokovic. Just incidentally. The court is playing really slow which is lucky for Djokovic because otherwise it might change the complexion of things to come. Now you must listen and understand that this game has been fixed for a long time…the engineering is out of control.

                    It's the racquet. That is what I was hoping for in the Open…but Monfils screwed that up with a sensational performance in the quarters. Then Federer was vulnerable for "The Sleeper" Marin Cilic to knock him out. He had no legs. Ok…no matter. The Champion is undeterred. Go back to the drawing board and come up with the next plan. Stefan Edberg and the racquet. Stefan has Federer resorting to the old school tactics which are not old school at all. They are merely fundamental tennis tactics and psychology. There is nothing new under the sun but more and more people are starting to not understand the importance of knowing your history.

                    In the world of tennis one can come off being ignorant without endangering the world. The same cannot be said for poiitics and foreign relations.

                    That match last night was exciting and riveting. I sure am glad that I was able to watch it here in the comfort of my office and not have to make the drive to the O2 and pay a zillion dollars. I don't particularly like crowds. You can understand why.
                    Last edited by don_budge; 11-14-2014, 01:52 AM. Reason: for clarity's sake...
                    don_budge
                    Performance Analysthttps://www.tennisplayer.net/bulleti...ilies/cool.png

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                    • #40
                      Originally posted by don_budge View Post
                      Guess which context I was using. Get a life. It is one thing to counter shots with players that have no more in mind than camping out on the baseline but it is quite another against a player that is trying to disrupt your game by any means necessary. You cannot pussyfoot around with the latter. Murray played like a woman…look for the lesbian coach to disappear.
                      Your comments are embarrassing.

                      That girl had a lot of courage coming out of the closet at the age of 19 when others haven't over fear and pressure. Guys like you are the reason these people have to hide.

                      I really wish you had kids. If one of them was gay or a lesbian would you really care? No (I hope).

                      This woman is a winner (Wimbledon champion). A character individual, who worked her ass off to get to the top just as much as any man.

                      The guy you are talking about is Andy Murray, an icon, and men's Wimbledon Champion.

                      He's likely on so many pain killers, unable to get out of bed in the morning and trying his best to be a pro's pro and compete when he likely should be sitting this one out and thinking about his future, playing with his kids down the road and leading a normal life.

                      I've seen so many guys like this, in pain and can't even tie their shoes in the morning. You lose like this, it isn't because you are soft, its because your body has completely broken down. Up's and down's. I think Andy just pushed it to hard, and went over the limit.

                      Lets hope he takes his time, recovers, doesn't listen to guys like you who create unrealistic pressure and gets back into form on his own timeline, and no one else's.

                      I hope this coach gets a chance next year, as its sad health wasn't in her players corner so we could get a good evaluation of what she could accomplish with this player at this stage of his career.

                      Time for a bit more respect.
                      Last edited by hockeyscout; 11-14-2014, 10:14 AM.

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                      • #41
                        Originally posted by don_budge View Post

                        Federer sent a message too over on the other half of the draw to Mr. Djokovic. Just incidentally. The court is playing really slow which is lucky for Djokovic because otherwise it might change the complexion of things to come. Now you must listen and understand that this game has been fixed for a long time…the engineering is out of control.
                        I am not sure I have seen Federer play any better than this. He's been at his rampant best at times. I hope we get a Federer v Djokovic final. I make Djokovic a centimetre better but there isn't a lot in it. For the sake of a good final, we need 'em both to get through.
                        Stotty

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                        • #42
                          The Semi's of the 2014 Barclays ATP World Tour Finals...

                          Originally posted by licensedcoach View Post
                          I am not sure I have seen Federer play any better than this. He's been at his rampant best at times. I hope we get a Federer v Djokovic final. I make Djokovic a centimetre better but there isn't a lot in it. For the sake of a good final, we need 'em both to get through.
                          Of all the luck…the sponsors and money changers have their dream semifinals. They couldn't have "fixed" it any better. In one semi you have the all-Swiss Davis Cup semi of Roger Federer and Stanislas Wawrinka and in the other you have the replay of the 2014 U. S. Open final between Novak Djokovic and Kei Nishikori that was perhaps one of the biggest upsets in the history of that tournament.

                          It looks like it has a good chance of coming down to than dream final of Stotty's. Just a little more foreplay…a little more window dressing and we get down to the main event. Roger is fine tuning and gaging every step of the way and meanwhile Novak Djokovic is just marching on.

                          Roger stands 14-2 head to head with his Davis Cup mate and Wawrinka has definitely been struggling with his confidence since winning the 2014 Australian Open. He doesn't seem comfortable wearing that big bull's eye on the back of his shirt. It is an interesting match for Federer psychologically wise as well. Afterall he just lambasted Andy Murray in a humiliating fashion…spanked him like a red-haired, left handed, unwanted step-child. What if he is in position to do the same to his Davis Cup partner? He can't do that…can he? You see the conundrum? Yet he knows that he cannot afford to play it soft as he is in assassin mode…gunning for Djokovic. He will need all of the incentives he can muster for that match.

                          Novak Djokovic on the other hand has his little nemesis to contend with. They stand head to head at 2-2. But give the psychological nod to Djokovic hands down. Kei Nishikori has been through the ringer since the U. S. Open and he too will have his share of problems living up to the expectations. Novak has a huge score to settle with Nishikori and Kei will definitely have to man up if he is to keep this close. Once Djokovic gets his claws in him he is not going to let up…that is for dead certain.

                          Match play psychology…right out of "Match Play and the Spin of the Ball". Bill Tilden is the book. Read it and weep all of you tennis maestros…and wannabes.
                          Last edited by don_budge; 11-15-2014, 02:47 AM. Reason: for clarity's sake...
                          don_budge
                          Performance Analysthttps://www.tennisplayer.net/bulleti...ilies/cool.png

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                          • #43
                            Djokovic with a hiccup in 2nd set but let's be honest, was this match ever in doubt?

                            Federer vs. Wawrinka. A gorgeous forehand vs. a gorgeous backhand. Who wins? Fed has been in scary form, wawrinka not so much. Swiss friends turn into swiss enemies today. I'm picking Roger in straights.

                            Kyle LaCroix USPTA
                            Boca Raton

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                            • #44
                              Originally posted by klacr View Post
                              I'm picking Roger in straights.

                              Kyle LaCroix USPTA
                              Boca Raton
                              Hmmm....4-6
                              Stotty

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                              • #45
                                Phew...one set each...my dream final is still on course.
                                Stotty

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