Serve and Volley: Tactical Components

[gzhpcu]

Don,
Are you familiar with the tenniswarehouse forum? It allows practically total freedom, and I now avoid it. Insults, childish behaviour.

I find an administrator like John who keeps a tight rein on things much better.

One can disagree here, I find, but you have to back it up with sound arguments and examples.

[don_budge]

No response...

Whenever someone posts on this forum any reader has a couple of options...you can respond, you can avoid reading a certain poster, you can read then ignore what is written or you can take it personally and be offended.

Don,
Are you familiar with the tenniswarehouse forum? It allows practically total freedom, and I now avoid it. Insults, childish behaviour.

I find an administrator like John who keeps a tight rein on things much better.

One can disagree here, I find, but you have to back it up with sound arguments and examples.

For example...I choose not to respond to this post. For no particular reason.

[klacr]

Back to tennis

This thread is gaining some traction. Sadly, for all the wrong reasons..

Back on track, I think the days of Edberg and Rafter style serve and volley are in a long hibernation, I'm not willing to bury it just yet. But as we all know, the game has changed and continues to change. How many variations of baseline tennis can we possibly have? I agree with Phil's comments on this being a society of instant gratification and we want results fast. But I also think this society if creative and intelligent enough to discover new ways to improve what was once dominant. Can serve and volley come back at the professional level? I really do hope so. Can it still be effective at a club or recreational level, absolutely.

For pro tennis, perhaps serve and volley will look much different than how you or I remember it. Remember the baseline rallies between Borg and Vilas? Compare those to the baseline rallies of Djokovic and Nadal today. Same idea, but executed in a much more dynamic way. Times are changing. This is a perfect time for a player to grow up, develop and break that mold. Will it take longer to perfect, depends on the athletes willingness and the coaches ability to steer that ship. I'm an optimist. I may be a minority, but somethings I just gotta stay loyal to and believe in. Never give up on something that makes you smile.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

[gzhpcu]

Kyle,
Don't you think if Rafter were playing now in his prime, he would be having success with his game, at least on grass? More so because nobody is used to it? Look at last year's Wimbledon when Roger Federer lost to a nobody who played consistent serve and volley.

[johnyandell]

DB and All,

The message I am sending is that the purpose of this Forum is to have lively, honest and even pointed discussion and, sure, argument. But with respect and accountability for what you say.

Read the guidelines if you want to understand, and pay attention to the definition of trolling. I've done this I think 3 times in 10 years. And in each case the Forum was better for it.

[GeoffWilliams]

Nobody likes personal attacks. It's a thing that makes you want to go elsewhere. That's usually why it's done, to drive out someone you disagree with. TW forum is disgusting that they don't manage those.

Another Kyle gem: "Never give up something that makes you smile." I would add, "Never give up someone who makes you laugh!", ha, ha.

I guess you could call Stakhovsky a nobody. In no other sport is the top 100th guy in the world at it a nobody.

[klacr]

Kyle,
Don't you think if Rafter were playing now in his prime, he would be having success with his game, at least on grass? More so because nobody is used to it? Look at last year's Wimbledon when Roger Federer lost to a nobody who played consistent serve and volley.

Phil,
Awesome question and thanks for contributing to this thread.

I absolutely agree! It's a different look than what most guys are used to. Being rushed on the first shot after your return from a guy that took it out of the air as a volley certainly makes you feel the pressure. No doubt. And yes, great example with Stakhovsky beating Federer at Wimbledon. However, he didn't win a match for 2 or 3 months after that on tour. Serve and volley executed at a very high level is artistic, incredible, nearly unbeatable stuff. look at the highlight reels on youtube of Edberg and Rafter, really inspiring stuff.

Also, Geoff brings up a very good point and one that has been mentioned on a previous thread. Stakhovsky being called a nobody, 100th best player in the world, damn thats tough. But thats tennis.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

[gzhpcu]

Am sure that Rafter playing like he did here, would still do great...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ds-2fSafzKY

[klacr]

Am sure that Rafter playing like he did here, would still do great...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ds-2fSafzKY

No doubts on that Phil. The tennis world needs more Rafters and less Gilles Simon and Andreas seppi. No disrespect to those guys but they don't elicit the energy and excitement that a serve and volleyer does.

Rafter was great, but there was no one he made it look better than Edberg. He was just...wow... Impressive.

Here's an Edberg/Henman match from 1996 US Open. And yes, Edberg won.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8HV6ANe4TAY

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton

[gzhpcu]

Rafter and Edberg matches have always been my favorites...

[giancarlo]

My point is that this site is supposedly a site for best practice, yet I see flaws in the volleyers' techniques.

I am a bit late to the party, but the more Tennisplayer thing to have done is actually to clearly describe the flaws you are seeing in the volleys. There is nothing wrong with a straight arm on the FH volley in certain situations. In fact, multiple videos from Pete (in stroke archive) clearly show a straight arm right before contact (on certain volleys).

While I totally agree that my volleys are not yet Edberg-like (I am working on it) it would have been more in this site's spirit to provide clear comments/feedback.

In fact, if you are the expert on the volleys, please come out to SF and I will gladly take a lesson.

Cheers,
gc

[johnyandell]

GC,


You are being modest and the descriptions of the alleged flaws aren't accurate anyway. WBTC, by the way, is no longer with us.

FYI: GC played number one on his college team at Dominican in Marin county, has been ranked in norcal men's open's, and has lead his club team to the national finals I believe that was 5.5, GC? He is Swiss and had a national ranking there before coming to the states.

As for Scott, he was an elite Norcal junior and returned to tennis after a college pitching career in baseball at Cal. He has been ranked in the top 10 in Nor Cal seniors and is also in high demand for league teams due to--guess what--his volleys, as well as his serve...

They did the demos just the way I requested...so...let's move on to actual interactive discussion and get away from negative trolling!

[GeoffWilliams]

Edberg was the best of all time at volleying. His extremely low, almost a 90 degree angle on his bent knee split step, was part of that. No one ever mentions how he came into net, lower at split, than anyone else in history. It is not a coincidence, that he was the best at moving laterally.

[stotty]

Edberg was the best of all time at volleying. His extremely low, almost a 90 degree angle on his bent knee split step, was part of that. No one ever mentions how he came into net, lower at split, than anyone else in history. It is not a coincidence, that he was the best at moving laterally.

He was even quicker moving forward I think. Never seen anyone move so swiftly and elegantly to the net behind his serve than Edberg. He's peerless in that department from what I have witnessed. Apparently Sedgman was quicker.

[klacr]

Edberg was the best of all time at volleying. His extremely low, almost a 90 degree angle on his bent knee split step, was part of that. No one ever mentions how he came into net, lower at split, than anyone else in history. It is not a coincidence, that he was the best at moving laterally.

All great points Geoff. Thank you.

I'm sure many of us on here could contribute to a very busy thread solely based on the greatness and beauty of Stefan Edberg's serve and volley game. Great stuff indeed.

His volleys were crisp and in fact that low split just made him that much more amazing. In relation to this article, he's a great example of a player that used his serve effectively to all corners of the boxes and with corresponding volleys to back it up. So often you'll see him hit that volley in front of him or the direction he's moving. Only breaking that rule when he is trying to end the point by going for a winner. I think what gets lost when watching a player like Edberg is the discipline it took for him to do that consistently.

I'm sure every player is guilty of going for that put away volley a little too soon knowing we probably weren't in the best position, only to have our opponent pass us and we are left with a bad taste in our mouths knowing that we knew better! But we also also know the pain of being passed will soon be gone as we are coming up to the net on the next point for redemption. Sweet redemption.

Kyle LaCroix USPTA
Boca Raton