The Forehand Volley

[don_budge]

Teaching beginners the surge forwards...and to retreat backwards

Unless the volley stroke is well developed, I've found that using/introducing the serge forward confuses the process quite a bit. I also don't want players to get so close to the net that they are easily lobed or more likely, passed. I like what your saying and believe it important but perhaps at much higher levels.

Regarding racquet size: I think the chances of reducing head size to 80 square inches is a pipe dream - its not going to happen. There isn't a current player using anything close to that today; would require massive retooling of molds; would significantly change teaching techniques (might be for the better); - IMO, just not a viable option that we will never see.

This sort of movement transcends even the volley and approach angles but of course with advanced players that is the main thrust. Recently I have begun teaching from the net backwards with the youngest of students and the least talented as well. I have found that the volley stroke is the simplest therefore that is the place to start with the beginner. Build on the simplest foundation and move on up.

I love to work the kids away from the net and then back again. In this way I can really get them to move whereas otherwise I need a cattle-prod it seems. They love it when I am shouting at them in mock desperation to "GET BACK" or "GO FORWARDS" (in Swedish of course). But stop and think about this for a moment. For beginners what is the most difficult ball for them to recognize at the moment that their opponent strikes the ball. To me it appears that the short ball is the one that is the most difficult for them to react to and the deep ball is a close second. This business of moving forwards and backwards gets them moving and teaches them to anticipate these types of shots and how to prepare to hit them...with some prodding.

But the thing about starting them at the net is a good idea too. It seems that modern tennis has almost created a phobia about pressing the issue at the net. Coaches don't even bother to drill this sort of game into their students whereas here at the forum we have an accomplished tennis player who has retooled his game and converted his thinking from a strictly baseline mentality to a player who strikes when the opportunity arises. True...the modern game creates some unique problems to pressing the issue at the net but on the other hand I imagine that there are some unique solutions to said problems. Imaginative approaches are one solution.

One of the solutions is to practice the movement forward and the corresponding shots that go with it. I swear the tennis coaching mentality was hijacked back in the mid 80's by Bollettieri and the rest of the minions and by now the truth is out about the actual depth of coaching that went into that era. I am not so sure that this sort of play cannot be incorporated even as Jeff Greenwald has retooled his game.

All that being said though...I hope that you actively try and engage your students in this kind of activity. You will find that at least it is a great conditioning regimen or it may change your thinking about the way the game is being played. My kids are noticeably happier with their training which makes me happy. What is more...I see more enthusiasm where before I saw boredom. It's fun and it is hard work. Great combination for tennis enthusiasts.

[makhan67]

It is somehow very hard for me to imagine a Director of Cardio Tennis in Islamabad. Why is it so hard for me to imagine Pakistanis running around wily nily in a Cardio tennis class?! But at the same time, it is very encouraging. And by the nature of his comments, I bet Mahboob runs a great cardio class. Somehow, I am sure it is very demanding. We may be so different and yet we are at the core really so very much alike.

don

Ha ha. Well, because of Afghan war it appears to the outside world that Pakistanis are only good in shooting people! Maybe it's true also because we fought against the Soviet Union for ten years and defeated them. The current war in Afghanistan is quite ugly and I can't talk about it.

Well, if you want to know my political views then you may like to read my comments at USAToday newspaper and other papers such as the Blaze and the Huffington Post, etc. I am on the Facebook as Mahboob Khan.

Pakistan has produced some great champions. I belong to Khan family and one of my relative Jehangir Khan was the world Squash Champion for over a decade. His winning streak of 555 matches in a row is a world record for any sport. After him came Jansher Khan who was also the World's Squash Champion. Pakistan field Hockey has won Gold in the Olympics, and under Imran Khan Pakistan Cricket Team had won the Cricket World Cup in 1992. Currently Pakistan is the World Champion in T20 Cricket. Our Aisam ul Haq Qureshi with his Indian partner Rohan Bopanna were runner up in the U.S. Open Doubles. They had wins over the likes of Bryan Brothers. In Singles Aisam had wins over Gasquet and Mardy Fish. Back in the 70s, Haroon Rahim had wins over the top players of the world including Jimmy Connors. Haroon Rahim had won two ATP Singles Titles in the Open era. I am number 2 in the world in the ITF ITN Skill Testing (www.oncourtassessment.com).

Cardio Tennis in Pakistan: In February this year I attended the PTR's International Tennis Symposium in Orlando, FL. In the PTR's International Tennis Championships I beat your Ken DeHart in three sets. Ken as you know is the National Director for Cardio Tennis. I picked up the idea from him and he also encouraged me to start this program in Pakistan which I did.

You may read my article here (Strategy) "The Tactical Universe". I have also uploaded thousands of tennis tips, articles, and instructions at www.tennis-warehouse.com.

My daughter Sarah Khan was Pakistan No. 1 tennis champion for six years. Currently, she is on an Athletic Scholarship in USA playing for her College. I am so happy for her.

John Yandell is a great friend of mine. His services to the game of tennis are simply outstanding.

Thank you for your observation and patience.

Mahboob Khan
Facebook: Mahboob Khan
Top Commenter USAToday.

[makhan67]

Nokomis: Thank you that you remember. I have restarted writing at the TW forum. Take care.

[nokomis]

Makhan 67

Mahboob,

Well your insight into the sport has been very accurate over the years and although we might have been at odds on small matters, I certainly agreed with you on just about everything - nice to hear everything is going well.

I have not followed TW much in the past couple of years - seemed to have become more a advertising board for Oscar Wegner and a few of his followers. Just got boring reading constant messages suggesting Oscar invented everything. I happen to like Oscar and have talked to him on a couple of occasions but his followers seem to be bent on claiming he invented all aspects of the game as its played today. Oh well, if your now posting there maybe others will come back as well and we can have some decent conversations again.

Papa

[makhan67]

Yes, Papa. That will be nice.

For the last couple of years I have been writing more as a commenter at USAToday and other American newspapers and magazines. I feel that the world is slipping out of our hands and our incompetent, corrupt, leaders are not doing enough to wage peace in the world. I see lots of racism and hatred. I have been suggesting people to people interaction and World Peace Conference to sort out all the nagging issues of conflicts and dissent.

If you are on the Facebook, send me a Friend request. I am there as Mahboob Khan. My picture is with Imran Khan.

Nice to know that you are well. Say my salam to your family.

[nokomis]

Yes, Papa. That will be nice.

For the last couple of years I have been writing more as a commenter at USAToday and other American newspapers and magazines. I feel that the world is slipping out of our hands and our incompetent, corrupt, leaders are not doing enough to wage peace in the world. I see lots of racism and hatred. I have been suggesting people to people interaction and World Peace Conference to sort out all the nagging issues of conflicts and dissent.

If you are on the Facebook, send me a Friend request. I am there as Mahboob Khan. My picture is with Imran Khan.

Nice to know that you are well. Say my salam to your family.

Mahboob,

Agree with you totally and this isn't a problem in your country alone - we see it everywhere. Racism and hatred cannot/should not be tolerated anywhere. Sports has helped but we have a long way to go - hopefully with appropriate interaction we can solve some of this. Fortunately, in the US we don't see/experience as much of this behavior but it still exists and probably always will.

Some/many are determined to reduce or eliminate the rights of others to further their own agendas. Greed plays a significant role but for others they only know a life of disruption and and the spread of violence - hard to change.

Anyways, as you have stated, perhaps if we could establish a more extended dialog with our neighbors throughout the world we could curb/modify this negative attitude of hate and build a better world. Sports is helping but we need a greater participation by all nations and their people to turn this around.

Papa

[nokomis]

Don

Yes, I see your points here and would agree that they present a viable option to what we see today. Nick (and a few others) of course always take the blame for certain changes in the game which some find, generally in retrospect, negative. Although I live very close to him and follow activities at IMG, I do not know him personally although we have spoken briefly from time to time. I happen to think his contributions to the game have been, for the most part, extremely favorable although I have not always agreed or supported his approaches.

We do practice having kids move in & out - maybe not as much as we should but its part of our training programs for several reasons as you stated. I find it interesting that "some" players, regardless of how much I push the issue, are just not comfortable at net. Those that play doubles, for the most part, will come to net on a regular basis but most singles players these days stay back - male & female. It can be frustrating to a coach when players will take the net only to retreat at the first possible opportunity.

I think this discussion is encouraging and creates opportunities that could very well be productive - for a time, I thought the S & V game was through, maybe its not. Many players fear getting caught in no-mans-land or even on the service line and as a result stay back - they probably fear the passing shot or lob too much.

[johnyandell]

Nokomis,

That was brutal over there at TW but the good news is that the two biggest zealot disciples quit or were forced to quit posting. I take at least partial credit for making that happen.

They left in a hail of nasty messages but neither they nor Oscar have been heard from since. The one disciple left there also backed way off his constant sales promos and personal attacks. He just seems like a harmless crank now.

Fighting with those guys for the last year or so I considered somewhere between a hobby and a form of free group therapy. The really interesting thing is that the more they were challenged the more they were willing to distort and fabricate the facts and the more personal they got in their attacks on anyone who dared to disagree--until I guess their heads finally exploded. It was a very interesting example of cult behavior though and the implications went way beyond tennis.

Oscar is an interesting personality type in the way a lot of would be cult leaders are interesting psychologically. I knew from previous experiences that that surface nicey nice thing wasn't real and I know a lot of other people in the various organizations and tennis media who had had nasty experiences with him similar to mine. It was really interesting watching him slowly reveal himself. The whole weird experience definitely backfired as part of his master plan to sell dvd's, take credit for world coaching development, and become the czar.

That was the scary wider point. If this wasn't tennis and Oscar was czar how would that have boded for people who dared to stand up to him?

[makhan67]

Papa and John: Let's keep the dialogue rolling. Together, we can make a world of difference!

Mahboob Khan

[nokomis]

Nokomis,

That was brutal over there at TW but the good news is that the two biggest zealot disciples quit or were forced to quit posting. I take at least partial credit for making that happen.

They left in a hail of nasty messages but neither they nor Oscar have been heard from since. The one disciple left there also backed way off his constant sales promos and personal attacks. He just seems like a harmless crank now.

Fighting with those guys for the last year or so I considered somewhere between a hobby and a form of free group therapy. The really interesting thing is that the more they were challenged the more they were willing to distort and fabricate the facts and the more personal they got in their attacks on anyone who dared to disagree--until I guess their heads finally exploded. It was a very interesting example of cult behavior though and the implications went way beyond tennis.

Oscar is an interesting personality type in the way a lot of would be cult leaders are interesting psychologically. I knew from previous experiences that that surface nicey nice thing wasn't real and I know a lot of other people in the various organizations and tennis media who had had nasty experiences with him similar to mine. It was really interesting watching him slowly reveal himself. The whole weird experience definitely backfired as part of his master plan to sell dvd's, take credit for world coaching development, and become the czar.

That was the scary wider point. If this wasn't tennis and Oscar was czar how would that have boded for people who dared to stand up to him?

John,

I know they really attacked you but you held your ground well. I'm certainly glad they (TW) stepped in and made some changes - however, they left it go on for way to long - one post had something like 100,000 responses many of which came from that group. I wrote TW on a couple of occasions but figured it was a hopeless cause. I think they started on those that supported you and your site.

I never could quite figure out their point but it sure got bad - I even started getting email outside of the web site so I figured I'd give it a rest. I think you remember me, I'm the Harvard guy who jabs you once in a while with the Yale thing.

There was one or two in particular that really seemed odd and another that had to be Oscar using a different name. Whenever cornered they would just blitz the site with numerous other mindless arguments to try to change the subject. I did get the impression that his followers were want-to-be types that for some reason wanted to be connected to the sport but couldn't qualify for certification though existing organizations like USPTA or PTR. They just never let up but TW seemed, to me anyways, to allow it to continue - I think it must have driven most away from the site. I used to buy a lot of stuff through TW for my teams and just went elsewhere.

Years ago I had a couple, perhaps several, conversations with Oscar when he was residing in Florida - never met him in person just phone calls. At that time, I did not get the feeling he was radical or off the wall. To be honest with you, I don't even remember what the subject was - probably related to his first book but I really don't remember.

[nokomis]

Tw

Thought I'd check about the current content on TW site these days - still a lot of talk about Oscar, his modern tennis theme, etc. Maybe they have come back like a bad penny.

[johnyandell]

Nokomis, Papa,

Sure I remember you!

Yeah it's funny they just keep generating new threads. I posted there again recently, but so far the worst of the disciples have stayed away. I think it's good in life sometimes to have to figure out how to deal with crazy stuff people are saying about you. I think I grew quite a bit by learning to desensitize myself and just stick to being me, matching intensity with critics, stating my thoughts clearly, and letting others think as they wish.

[johnyandell]

And now back to the forehand volley. I loved Paul's emphasis on the left arm in the preparation! The modern player who did that brilliantly was Rusedski.

But check out the high speed forehand volley archives and see that not every player does that.

http://www.tennisplayer.net/members/high_speed_archive/volleys/forehand_volley/forehand_volley_high_speed.html?TimHenmanFHVWarmUpFront-001-0001_Tennisplayer440.pct

Personally I think it's huge for solid early contact and maybe Paul is right that this explains in part why the forehand volley isn't a key shot in the modern game.

The other guy on the site that stresses the left arm but in a slightly different way is Pat Cash:

http://www.tennisplayer.net/members/famouscoach/pat_cash/developing_world_class_volleys_the_forehand_volley/

[nokomis]

This might sound a little strange but I like my players to track the ball into their racquets as if they were holding a fly-swatter - keeping the racquet up, out in front of the plane of the body and completely to right of the right hand (obviously left handed players). If you track the ball this way, your opponent has no idea where your going to hit, your consistency will increase and you'll find it a lot easier to play the ball. Same method works well on both sides but I'm somewhat reluctant to endorse using two hands - yes, I know some are very good at it and I've had a couple but for most, I suggest just using one hand.

Too many players, especially at the lower levels, try to take way too big a swing, run completely through the ball and end up either netting the ball or flying it long as a result.

[stotty]

Follow through

I think there are myths about the volley when it comes to the swing. High paceless balls require a longish swing. Just look in the archive at how Kramer and Pancho followed through on many of their forehand volleys. More than any coaching manual would advocate. Henman's has a more compact volley, but even he has a longer follow through on high balls and even medium high balls sometimes. It seems to vary...probably something to do with how well the weight is distributed at the time of impact.

Perhaps the important thing is not to muscle the follow through but to relax the arm once you've penetrated the shot. It's hard to tell whether Kramer and Pancho are doing this from the archive clips (they seem quite muscular about it, actually), but it's certainly what I do...so the follow through harmlessly dissipates.

I notice from the archive that backhand volleys have a longer swing than forehand volleys with most players. Rafter and Henman have far more extensive swings on their backhand wing than their forehand.

I notice also that players from yesteryear have longer follow throughs than players of today. If you google British Pathe, then search for Frank Sedgman, you will see he has an extensive follow through on his forehand volley. Sedgman was widely considered to be the best volleyer of his day amongst his peers.

If you appreciate great volleying you have to go way back in time to see volleying done at it's best...to a time when volleying was the more dominant game style. I think the art has been lost...today's players aren't doing it right. Volleys are probably a little too restricted these days. Djokovic stabs...awful.

Here are two blokes whose volleys flow...look how comfortable they are at the net...look at the balls they pick up with their diddy little rackets...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Q13_STOUBc

The technique for volleying has not changed one jot since the days of Tilden, unlike like all the other strokes in tennis, which have evolved and changed significantly over time.

The best thing you can do to improve your students' volleys might be to look back in time, not forward.