2011 U. S. Open Tennis Championships

[stotty]

Instead of coronating djokovic and applauding his mental strength, what do you guys think Nadal should specifically start working on in practice in order to have a better chance against Djoko?

His serve...needs to serve out wide better (like Mac)....Nadal looks only half-cocked on his serve....that tight little arm action he's got...also that narrow stance doesn't do him any favours either.

[gsheiner]

Good point. Although I always thought he hit that serve effectively against federer. Do you think he was deliberately trying to serve to Djokovic's body to jam him?

[tennis_chiro]

Totally agree, but...

Okay, I won't "coronate" him.

Sometimes I like Djoker's theatrics but I didn't, in the semi-final, when he threw his arms out for the crowd. "Me, me, me! A great shot! Don't you agree?"

Fine, except a singles tennis match isn't about one person. There's somebody on the other side of the net and deserving of respect. Along with another match point, which deserves respect as well. Those two match points were earned, which also deserved respect.

If it was the end of a Djoker poker match, someone might say, "Great move!"

But tennis is better. Djoker, you just should have shut up. Wonder if you would have won.

There was nothing illegal in what you did, but it was at least as purposefully disrupting as Serena's infraction of the hindrance rule, and I believe there should be a cosmological fine for you, just as there was a real fine for her, and universal recognition that you tainted your own victory.

I totally agree with you that Djokovic demeaned his victory a little with that move asking for acknowledgement from the crowd. But as you say, it is within the rules; certainly a lot more than making his opponent wait in a ready position, depleting his strength, while Nole interminably bounces the ball until he is good and ready to serve.

(My advice to one of my students who was familiar with my toss and catch drills would be to simply do the toss and catch a few times and then without a pause simply go ahead and serve. It is no more against the rules than what Djokovic is doing. If the umpire had problems with the ball leaving your hand, you would certainly be able to do a "dry toss and catch drill" where you didn't toss the ball but rocked back and forth about to serve until you felt good and ready. You would be accused of unfairly having the opponent wait in a ready position for any of those fake "tosses and catches", but it would be no less than what Nole is doing with that multiple toss. Just force the umpire to enforce the rules evenly between both players and I think we would soon be rid of the multiple bounces!)

However, it is also totally within the rules in such a situation for Federer to step away. He did not. He looked, to me at least, like he was visibly irritated by the action by Djokovic; you would certainly never see Federer doing such a thing. But Federer did not step away. He misplayed the next ball and a couple of points later was completely out of gas. I was stunned by his comments in the press conference. He was really in shock after that return. That's why it was all the sadder for me. Give credit to Djoker for trying the shot and finding a way out. But Fed didn't make it all the way to the end of the match.

don

[don_budge]

Past tense...

Okay, I won't "coronate" him.

Sometimes I like Djoker's theatrics but I didn't, in the semi-final, when he threw his arms out for the crowd. "Me, me, me! A great shot! Don't you agree?"

Fine, except a singles tennis match isn't about one person. There's somebody on the other side of the net and deserving of respect. Along with another match point, which deserves respect as well. Those two match points were earned, which also deserved respect.

If it was the end of a Djoker poker match, someone might say, "Great move!"

But tennis is better. Djoker, you just should have shut up. Wonder if you would have won.

There was nothing illegal in what you did, but it was at least as purposefully disrupting as Serena's infraction of the hindrance rule, and I believe there should be a cosmological fine for you, just as there was a real fine for her, and universal recognition that you tainted your own victory.

Yep...btw, I was not coronating Djokovic, I was merely acknowledging the obvious. He is the dominating tennis player today. I am sort of sorry that I made the reference. But not really.

Professor...I couldn't agree with you more. The reaction may of had some effect on the last surviving link to classic tennis...Roger Federer. It's a shame he didn't throw one more dart to the heart.

Djokovic will not be receiving any cosmological fine...he is the cosmological fine...and coincidently the slayer of "The King". There won't be any universal reaction...there is too much apathy. Nobody cares..let alone understands.

But perhaps you meant "tennis was better". This behavior is now the norm in all sports. NBA style. Everyone is mesmerized by the speed...it's shock and awe that they adore. The disappearance of subtlety, manners, etiquette, standardized equipment...these are matters of the past, for those old enough to know better to resolve in their hearts.

[tennis_chiro]

What would James Bond have done?

I was going to just write, "Yes, not absolutely, but just too true today."

Then a though occurred to me. What would James Bond have done? If Federer is James Bond then Djokovic is,perhaps, Christopher Walken's evil Max Zorin in "A View to Kill" (trying to blow up Silicone Valley), always asking for a little more applause. Is the crowd now cheering for Max Zorin? Can it be? Is James Bond dead?? Pretty scary thought. What will the free world do? How will anyone ever get a good martini again?

don

[stotty]

I saw little of the US Open other than highlights. Was anyone in the forum at the final and saw the match live? From some of the clips it looks like Novak was pumping his forehand with heavy topspin to Rafa's backhand...some were very angled and drew Rafa off court.... they looked to be "rearing" up aggressively....Rafa looks to be really struggling to return some of them and just pokes them back with slice.

When watching on TV you can never see how much spin players are using...whatever he is doing to that ball it's very effective...Nadal looks stumped for answers.

[bottle]

Christopher Walken walkin along.

[don_budge]

2009 semifinal US Open...Federer vs. Djokovic

Okay, I won't "coronate" him.

Sometimes I like Djoker's theatrics but I didn't, in the semi-final, when he threw his arms out for the crowd. "Me, me, me! A great shot! Don't you agree?"

Fine, except a singles tennis match isn't about one person. There's somebody on the other side of the net and deserving of respect. Along with another match point, which deserves respect as well. Those two match points were earned, which also deserved respect.

If it was the end of a Djoker poker match, someone might say, "Great move!"

But tennis is better. Djoker, you just should have shut up. Wonder if you would have won.

There was nothing illegal in what you did, but it was at least as purposefully disrupting as Serena's infraction of the hindrance rule, and I believe there should be a cosmological fine for you, just as there was a real fine for her, and universal recognition that you tainted your own victory.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1EGz8AeqAPY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JVltZ7zWJXE

Check this out bottle et al. Let's compare the reactions of the two miraculous shots. What is the difference? Is one reaction more acceptable than another and if so, why?

[don_budge]

Considerable thought...leads to possibilities.

Rafa needs some new patterns and new weapons against Djoko.


Someone once said the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result. ( or something to that effect).

Nadal has more or less been playing the same game 6 times now with predictable results.

He needs to improve and to me his biggest weakness is his backhand return --he justs gives too many big points away against mediocre serves. Even Murray was serving and volleying to rafa's backhand in the deuce court with great success.

Nadal is getting beat on neutral rallies which is why it's so important for him to creat advantage if he can on the return.

...what do you guys think Nadal should specifically start working on in practice in order to have a better chance against Djoko?

Well gsheiner...after giving things considerable thought, I have come up with a couple of ideas, for Nadal. Not that he would ever in his lifetime listen to me...afterall, who am I? Boy...there's a great question for me to ponder, who am I?

But anyways I was looking at the two views of Nadal's backhand on this month's issue of Tennisplayer.net and it occurred to me that his technique on his backhand is not half bad. His technique is quite nice on both his two handed and his slice. I very much like in particular his footwork and transfer of weight on both shots. I believe he has more potential to be developed on his backhand...room for improvement. I disagree with the school of thought that requires players to be "perfect" in their technique...we all must learn to deal with our shortcomings and tennis players are no different. They must learn how to manage. So how is it that Djokovic is beating him by exploiting him on his backhand. The answer to that is I believe one of tactics. Nadal needs to develop more options on his backhand side.

1. Djokovic is manhandling Nadal on the service. His assortment of wide deliveries and up the middle has Nadal befuddled to the point that many times he turns his back on his opponent after his futile efforts on wide backhands. One idea...and it is only an idea and flies in the face of conventional wisdom which is blast away at all costs, is to learn to float, as well as drive the ball back into the Djokovic backhand corner or attempt to keep it low at his feet. By doing this he of course risks coming up short and having the little yellow pill shoved down his throat but on the other hand if he successfully gets the ball in play on the returns that he is currently outright losing the point on, he will at least have a percentage of points that he can neutralize and reengage Djokovic in his subsequent baseline duel. Winning a couple of points in this manner may actually result in the break of serve that he is desperately in need of. Nadal will probably have to choose one side or the other to be somewhat aggressive on with regard to the return of serve on any given serve which will leave him more or less playing defense on the other side. The question is...which defensive shot will give him the best chance of neutralizing the point. If I'm Nadal...or anybody that is concerned about his future, I am studying the McEnroe return of serve. He was a master at the neutralizing shots...and he wasn't blasting the cover off of the ball.

2. Nadal could develop a third option on his backhand...to begin with and this may require some modification to his technique by developing the ability to leave the racquet head down into the ball instead of lifting up. If Nadal were the tactical genius of say a McEnroe or a Nastase he might have seventeen or eighteen options available on his backhand. The option that I would first like to experiment with is a short slice backhand that will have the effect of drawing his opponent into the forecourt, either on the forehand or the backhand and cause his opponent to hit up to him. Tactically, when you have an opponent with an extreme grip such as the Djokovic forehand one tends to theorize that the weakness of such an extreme grip is on a ball that stays low and away. His grip is obviously very strong on balls that are in the mid to high range so I would be shooting for him to be hitting balls around his ankles where he may be weaker...make him dig as much as I can. Llodra was successful in this tactic against Djokovic at the Paris Masters on a relatively fast court. Coincidentally, both Llodra and Nadal are both left handed and this has traditionally been a favorite strategy of left handers...get the opponent to hit up on the forehand then move him deep into the backhand corner. Again this is an opportunity to play around with the idea in number one...move him as long a distance as possible and then move him back. Keep him off balance with change of speed. Tomic was somewhat successful using some variation of this tactic on the Djokovic backhand at Wimbledon and so was Dogopolov at the Open. Neither had the experience or the overall moxy to pull this tactic off to completion. Most of you are probably to young to remember Arthur Ashe's defeat of a heavily favored Jimmy Connors at Wimbledon many years ago. This is not a option based on pure speed...it is a combination of speed and placement.

3. Nadal needs to develop balls that are deep into the right handers backhand corner...and this will probably mean that he must flatten out his backhand some and at the same time feel confident enough to go down the line...much as Djokovic has done in the last year. This would be something in the middle of his slice and normal two handed backhand. From the two views of his backhand in this months issue it looks to me that he is capable of such a change...the question is will his camp correctly identify the tactical deficiencies he currently has against the Djokovic game. Djokovic currently controls the middle part of the court and this is where Nadal needs to reassert himself if he has any hopes of competing with his Serb nemesis.

4. Another tactic that Nadal may wish to add to his repertoire is using his forehand to go short and wide with spin to his opponents backhand, much as Djokovic is using against him. It seems to me that Nadal prefers to bludgeon his opponents deep into the backhand corner until he gets the ball that he likes to go up the line with. If he adds an option such as the one that Djokovic has successfully employed against him it may give him another element of surprise.

The other notable weakness...or chink in the Nadal armor is his serve of course. Numerous other posters have referenced this. In this case his technique needs to be modified because it is not up to the demands of the task. His lack of a free range of motion in his abbreviated version results in a reduction in possible deliveries in terms of speed, spin and placement. This is simply giving up too much against an opponent like Djokovic. His motion is inferior and without a change he will probably have a difficult time...no make that an impossible time of coming up with the level of confidence in his service game required to raise the level of his overall game significantly. Tommy English (aka tpatennis) told me an interesting story in this department but I leave it to him to share it with us if he chooses...I wouldn't want to steal his thunder.

Nadal certainly must reassess things with regards to the control of the middle of the chess board...or rather the tennis court if he has any hopes of regaining some semblance of control. It doesn't appear to me that his deficiencies are so much technical as tactical...except with regard with his serve. Playing from the reflection in the mirror (left handed) there is a built in advantage in the service game and Nadal at this point has not actualized this built in asset. While an argument can be made that Djokovic's improvements have been technical in nature, to me this is missing the point. The fact of the matter is Djokovic is playing smarter tennis. Any improvements he has made in his technique he has also capitalized on in the tactical department...which is the bottom line, to winning tennis matches.

Federer in the same respect may profit in this analysis...if I might be so bold to suggest. He does not employ the slice backhand as much as he might, or as much as he used to for that matter and he seems to prefer to go with the cross court topspin which unfortunately for him goes right into the teeth of his two toughest opponent's strengths currently. There were moments during his match against Djokovic when he used the slice quite effectively but he never seemed to stick with it on any consistent basis. Again, I don't so much believe that his technique is defective as his tactical frame of reference is deficient...and that being said he has made a rather substantial living exploiting two handed backhands. Over the years Roger has demonstrated his capability of hitting low and wide to the two hander forcing them to use one hand...then he has them.

One tactical ploy that seems to be effective against two handed backhands is the change of speed tactic...nothing balls and subtle variations of spin and depth...combined with power and speed. I prefer to slice my opponents up a bit before applying the coup de gras. It may just be a bit tougher to deal with this tactic on the two handed side because of the lack of options inherently available with two hand backhands. The strength of the two hand backhand is not it's flexibility...as in number of options. As I mentioned before, a McEnroe or a Nastase seemed to have a whole boatload of options...all designed to confuse, befuddle or infuriate the opponent. I think that they would both of made great matadors with their mercurial ability to slice up their opponents and then applying...ever so lovingly, the fatal stab. Maybe there is hope for Nadal...seeing that he is from Spain.

[gsheiner]

DonB,

Interesting insights.

I hope uncle Toni watches a lot of film and is sucessful in taking Rafa in a slightly new direction that may lead to revenge against the Djoker. Although, I sense that changing the serve technique may be unrafaish ( he seems to be a litle obsessive as opposed to an experimenter)

And, maybe Uncle Toni should come up with a few first class tickets to Marbella and invite coaches like you to brainstrom with. Actually, I wonder who Toni consults with if anybody.

[bottle]

A substantial essay, don_budge, that should help anyone, even or especially a person as interested in dreaming up technique as myself.

The similarity of chess and tennis should never be underestimated.

On the other hand, getting on top of one's new technique involves physiology, further intention and time.

What a mix. What a great game.

I'm thinking right now of Phil Picuri's affection for the simplicity and deviousness of Bobby Riggs' modus operandi. I know what happened to Bobby Riggs but what has happened to Phil?

[bottle]

All About Acceptable Behavior

Re # 38, which offers a conundrum-- sometimes it takes a while, but here's my reaction. Let Djoker be Djoker, Federer Federer, Bottle Bottle, but not WBC act as if he's the world's best coach, bottling his precious bodily fluids for later sale.

Colonel Jack Ripper in DR. STRANGELOVE might be an effective tennis coach-- I wouldn't be surprised-- but he certainly wouldn't be the one I wanted to hire.

As for Djoker's histrionics, which I felt turned the 2011 semi-final: I'm ready to ease up on my moralizations.

Let's just say, "O tempora, O mores," which should cover you, me and yogurt, too (I'll go that far but refuse to use the moniker WBC more than once per post). No free advertising for him. And there are certain people my partner Hope, the business consultant, tells me I should not allow to rent space inside my brain.

[don_budge]

Green Acres moments...Eddie Arnold and Zsa Zsa Gabor

DonB,

Interesting insights.

I hope uncle Toni watches a lot of film and is sucessful in taking Rafa in a slightly new direction that may lead to revenge against the Djoker. Although, I sense that changing the serve technique may be unrafaish ( he seems to be a litle obsessive as opposed to an experimenter)

And, maybe Uncle Toni should come up with a few first class tickets to Marbella and invite coaches like you to brainstrom with. Actually, I wonder who Toni consults with if anybody.

So I am showing my wife here in Sweden my posts that I write and she just looks at me and says they are too long for anyone to read.

Men and women...boys and girls. You guys know the song and dance. Nothing new under the sun. So I show her your reply to me, Glenn and we get to the point in your post where you write that maybe Uncle Toni should be coming up with the tickets. I wanted to show her that SOMEBODY actually listens to me...as if she ever will.

So many times we have had these "Green Acres" moments, if you are old enough to remember the old TV sitcom with Eddie Arnold and Zsa Zsa Gabor where they have these precious misunderstandings due to the language barrier. Her Hungarian accent is just adorable...her innocence and naivete equally becoming.

Out of our short discussion about the forum she says to me in her Swedish accent..."Who's Uncle Toni?" Can you hear my eyes roll in their sockets?

[gsheiner]

Ask her if she knows who Lennart Bergelin is