Classic Don Budge serve...

[gzhpcu]

http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=8024

This was taken at an indoor tournament in Wembley stadium London.... the linesmen wore tuxedos!...talk about classy times...
Watch Budge's beautiful serve towards the end of the short clip...

[stotty]

Fascinating clip! His serve looks fluid. I toggled thru the clip as slowly as the video controls would allow to see how linear the action was. Is it me or is his elbow slightly dropped and a little lower than it should be?

I'd be interested to see what others think....

[gzhpcu]

Fascinating clip! His serve looks fluid. I toggled thru the clip as slowly as the video controls would allow to see how linear the action was. Is it me or is his elbow slightly dropped and a little lower than it should be?

I'd be interested to see what others think....

First the backswing:


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You mean this?


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then drop:


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and then impact:


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[stotty]

Yep...that's what I mean

[gzhpcu]

I updated my previous post to show the various phases of the serve...

since only 4 pictures post, here is post impact:


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The stroke archive has two nice Don Budge studies showing his serve from different angles...

[stotty]

Thanks, Phil! What a find, getting a clip of Budge serving....and in clarity!

His knees seem at odds in the first clip...bowing out in opposite directions as oppose to keeping together. That could just be the angle of the photo of course...from another it might look more orthodox....photos and clips can sometimes be deceiving like that.

Thanks so much for posting the clip

[gzhpcu]

What I see in the study, is that Don Budge has a lot of torso angle (sideways and forward) at impact. Pronounced body snap...

[uspta990770809]

Another Tilden/Vines clip from early 30's

Phil,
great clip. Must say, I agree the elbow drop is a no-no, but Budge seems to have a pretty modern motion otherwise. That "trophy position" is pretty classic. Perhaps the one foot on the court keeps him a little lower than Sampras as he goes up, but if you tilt his shoulders just a little more, that looks a lot like Sampras. He apparently had great shoulder over shoulder action.

Ed Weiss sent me this link to another Tilden Vines clip from the same site:

http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=4863

Of these few clips we've been looking at, I think this one you've posted here gives the best impression that they are really playing at a high level. But it still feels a little like the kind of tennis one plays in an exhibition match with weaker players on the court that you want to make look good. Or when the teaching pro fills out a foursome in the ladies morning game. It's just not up to speed.

don

[gzhpcu]

Talking about the low elbow postion:

Lew Hoad also had it:


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but Gonzalez didn't:


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[stotty]

I'd like to see Hoad's serve from another angle...not convinced anyone who served as well as that could have a dropped elbow. You can't always rely on clips taken from obscure angles.

[gzhpcu]

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[uspta990770809]

How do you find this stuff?

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Another nice find, Phil. And, of course, Rosewall kept him from getting that Grand Slam.

Stotty, I think the point is that you can still serve well with that. If we had slow motion of these serves, I'm sure we would see that they still had good "pro drop" positions following these elbow drops. I'm convinced it's harder to be effective and consistent with that "elbow drop", but then I still don't understand how anyone hits the ball with a full Western. I mean, ... I understand, ... but I really can't feel it.

But I do think you would see the racket going up to the ball for a good bit of time from that "pro drop" in any good serve, unless the guy is an absolute beast.

don

[gzhpcu]

More Lew Hoad...


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[gzhpcu]

Hoad versus Gonzalez.... Gonzalez won..
http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=34567

[gzhpcu]

But getting back to Budge... here's another cool video..http://www.britishpathe.com/record.php?id=19427