Interactive Forum November 2009: Mardy Fish Forehand

[EricMatuszewski]

The straight arm hitting arm position debate continues, and here is another straight arm guy Mardy Fish. The question is does he do the same things as the other straight arm guys with bigger forehands? How much of this is technical or does raw ability play the same or greater role? Gentlemen and women, your opinions please.

Mardy Fish Forehand 1



Mardy Fish Forehand 2

[EricMatuszewski]

Quicktime versions

Mardy Fish Forehand 1



Mardy Fish Forehand 2

[brentabel]

What body part is going to survive?

I love innovation, but trying to copy a straight arm forehand looks pretty risky to me.

Everything has to be perfect from body alignment to the path of the incoming ball, grip, hand tension, releasing the wrist out through the ball at the very last possible moment so the racket head can get enough racket speed, and on and on...

I don't know, it's fun to study, but I'd be very careful with not only how it's taught to us mere mortals, the sequence of the learning of the different mechanics, the physical condition of the student, and most important of all, to not think that this shot is going to be the shot that's going to take you to the next level.

Just my two cents, but one had better be really well organized with trying to teach this shot.

And obviously the risks are doing some temporary (or worse, permanent) damage to body parts...

Brent - WebTennis.net

[jperedo]

Regarding the Fish forehand, the most noticable thing is a slower windshield wipe compared to Fed and Verdasco. IMO probably the result of a subtle (almost unnoticable) difference in the backswing which reduces the stretch shorten effect on the internal rotators.

Agree with Brent regarding the teaching. Have yet to see what I consider to be key elements in the backswing of the straight arm style being formally identified. The modern straight arm isn't just a function of straightening the arm. IMO teaching someone to simply hit with a straight arm without understanding the subtleties of the backswing will probably fail at replicating it.

[bottle]

Sorry to be contrary, but I don't believe anything that anyone says about this type of shot unless they themselves hit it all the time. It literally did take me to the next level after 25 years of hitting the ball the other way. I find it easy to produce and far healthier than all the bent-arm stuff-- mainly because the ball stays in the court, which is good for my head.

I agree with J. Paredo that backswing is all-important. And when I look at these videos, I see a much smaller loop than either Federer (with more circularity) or Del Potro (with more verticality) or Verdasco (with more in between). Not that a big loop contributes power in a well designed forehand; in fact, the scientific drawing made from TennisPlayer video on page 135 of TECHNICAL TENNIS, Cross and Lindsey, shows Federer only accelerating his racket from low point about a foot behind his right hip.

Having a large circular but not very high loop like Federer allows anybody to swing slowly and feelingly from way back by the rear fence. One does need to learn one's technical objectives, which can be accomplished by trial-and-error until tennis instruction, never particularly adaptable, catches up. One has plenty of space in which to accomplish these objectives (for a million dollars I'll reveal them or you could read some old posts). In fact, lots of people know what they are although they would probably state them differently.

One thing I've noticed in this perennial dispute is that it gets most heated when the debaters discuss two different forms of the straight arm shot and think they're talking about the same thing. There are shots where the mondo takes the strings backward at contact, cushioning the 200-pound shock that Cross and Lindsey write about. And there are other shots taken wide where wrist unfurls at last second with shearing energy directed toward the outside
(healthy with no WMD's built in once again).

If short arm players used racketball rackets, they could shorten their effective levers even more.

[johnyandell]

Admittedly it's only a few examples, but one thing that strikes me is his hip turn--or it's lack. The left arm stretch looks good and his shoulder turn appears quite full. But look at the line of the hips. They aren't supposed to turn as much as the shoulders but if you compare Fish to Federer it appears Federer gets his hips more square to the net on more balls.

[nabrug]

One thing I've noticed in this perennial dispute is that it gets most heated when the debaters discuss two different forms of the straight arm shot and think they're talking about the same thing. .

And very funny.