Are you an experienced coach?

[tcuk]

It's always difficult to tell coaches from tennis enthusiasts on this site, but I'm looking for input and help from experienced, skilled coaches regarding a serving dilemma.

I am a dedicated coach who puts hours in well beyond the call of duty. I enjoy coaching. It's a job that goes further than just earning money for me. I'm very serious about what I do and simply live and breath tennis.

I've changed many serves over my career. I usually try to work around the student's basic natural action when tweaking and improving. I also make sure each process is cemented before moving onto the next stage. When you have players from 9 to 13 years old, what's the rush?

I have one student, though, who is proving a challenge. He has a classic swing, but the swing is very deep and long. When he commences the swing he picks up a lot of speed as he goes past his toes, then he slows right up until just before the throwing action and then speeds up again. The result is that he never picks up enough speed again to be able to serve hard.

He can't seem to gradually gather pace throughout the swing. He always goes too fast at the start and I think this is his major problem.

I'd like to trim his deep swing down a bit to solve the probem. I just wondered how other coaches go about doing this. I'm good at getting kids to do a Rafter or a Roddick (abbreviated style), but in this case I only want to trim a bit off the bottom of the swing.

I would upload a video for viewing but I'm not sure how to go about it. Or I could research how to do it thru youtube. In the meantime, any suggestions would be most welcome.

The boy is 13, but physically 12, and slightly built.

[carrerakent]

tcuk, are you using any visuals for him? or is he focusing on his motion instead of visuals of what he wants the ball to do on the other side of the net? what i'm getting at is he "left" or "right" brained when serving?

i have a kid that is now 14, but started with him when he had just turned 12. i worked with him for ages trying everything to get him to start generating racket head speed on ground strokes and serves. turned out that when i gave him some right brain activities and some little trickery on my part, he miraculously started hitting everything harder.

good luck

[tcuk]

He understands the visual side of things. He's seen himself serve and examples of others. He isn't a particularly maleable when it comes to adapting. And he can't control his too-early racket speed. I feel the secret would be to cut a piece out of the swing - but it's how to go about it. I don't want a complete abbreviation.

I'll upload a video clip when next I get the chance. It's so hard to convey things by text.

[uspta146749877]

Uploading a video

It's always difficult to tell coaches from tennis enthusiasts on this site, but I'm looking for input and help from experienced, skilled coaches regarding a serving dilemma.

I am a dedicated coach who puts hours in well beyond the call of duty. I enjoy coaching. It's a job that goes further than just earning money for me. I'm very serious about what I do and simply live and breath tennis.

I've changed many serves over my career. I usually try to work around the student's basic natural action when tweaking and improving. I also make sure each process is cemented before moving onto the next stage. When you have players from 9 to 13 years old, what's the rush?

I have one student, though, who is proving a challenge. He has a classic swing, but the swing is very deep and long. When he commences the swing he picks up a lot of speed as he goes past his toes, then he slows right up until just before the throwing action and then speeds up again. The result is that he never picks up enough speed again to be able to serve hard.

He can't seem to gradually gather pace throughout the swing. He always goes too fast at the start and I think this is his major problem.

I'd like to trim his deep swing down a bit to solve the probem. I just wondered how other coaches go about doing this. I'm good at getting kids to do a Rafter or a Roddick (abbreviated style), but in this case I only want to trim a bit off the bottom of the swing.

I would upload a video for viewing but I'm not sure how to go about it. Or I could research how to do it thru youtube. In the meantime, any suggestions would be most welcome.

The boy is 13, but physically 12, and slightly built.

Please put your question in the section enitled "Have a question for me"
to help you to upload a video for viewing if possible

[carrerakent]

Please put your question in the section enitled "Have a question for me"

why would he put it in that section? i'm assuming he's wanting to ask the question to coaches at large...not Yandell. true?

[uspta146749877]

I corrected/expanded\ my post above

why would he put it in that section? i'm assuming he's wanting to ask the question to coaches at large...not Yandell. true?

I corrected/expanded\ my post above

[carrerakent]

He understands the visual side of things. He's seen himself serve and examples of others. He isn't a particularly maleable when it comes to adapting. And he can't control his too-early racket speed. I feel the secret would be to cut a piece out of the swing - but it's how to go about it. I don't want a complete abbreviation.

I'll upload a video clip when next I get the chance. It's so hard to convey things by text.

Tcuk, i run across lots of people trying to immolate the roddick abbreviated serve motion, but from what i've seen with most players it doesn't work. we teach an abbreviated motion that is not quite as rigid. roddick's motion is so herky jerky.

with the old classic swing the racket down and up to a cocked position, people often do not get the coil of the body and the racket position early enough and therefore the racket seems to lag behind once they begin the motion to the ball. (lots of top women pros are a good example of that)


the abbreviated motion may not be working for people because they may not be going up to the ball properly (energy/force wise).

can you explain what part of the abbreviated motion you didn't like?

[tcuk]

The swing is very deep, he goes down by his toes...he strikes the ball at varying heights as a result sometimes. I want to clip a bit off the bottom...maybe by getting him to bend at the elbow and so bring the racket up thru that part of the swing quicker.

Awfully difficult to explain these things via text. I'm gonna upload a clip when next I see the kid.

[rosheem]

In my opinion, you hit on the solution with you idea to get him to bend the elbow.

Have him start bending the elbow immediately from the toss.

Keep the elbow collapsed through the entire motion until triceps extension to contact.

This will compact the entire motion. You can eventually add some of his elements back in, but this might at least give him the feel for unfolding the swiss army knife gradually from the inside out with smooth acceleration.

[tcuk]

Rosheem, this is the route I intend to take... rather than pulling the racket straight up and making the swing really short.

I actually prefer longish swings as they seem to give players better rythm. The longer the match goes on, the more the serve gets in it's groove. Very abbreviated take backs seem to have the opposite effect; the longer the match goes on the less they seen to go in. Has anyone else observed this?

I'm going to post before and after clips soon.

[carrerakent]

tcuk,

yes, i have recently experienced my students getting "worse" on the serve as a match goes on with the abbreviated motion. i say recently because i have only started teaching that method recently for students who do not have a good rhythm and thus do not reach a good coiled position early enough to explode.

but, their serves get worse because they start focusing on the right arm and not the coil of the full unit. as soon as i remind them with a visual of me showing the motion with full coil and/or emphasize the use of their lats in the motion, they immediately correct the problem.

so, i don't think it's a thing of the motion, but of a tendency to of the player to focus on the wrong part(s).

something i don't think we've talked about is the collapse of the right arm position in the abbreviated motion of most people. when the students use the deltoids to establish the right arm "top" position, it becomes rigid and jerky like roddick's. again, the emphasis of the lats and a position that looks like federer at the before the swing sure keeps the whole thing producing more racket head speed and few shoulder issues.

hope this helps.